0:00 The long road leading to the Gaza War9:14 Don’t Palestinians have some responsibility for the current state of affairs?9:48 The precedent of the 1973 Yom Kippur War11:26 Omer: Israel only negotiates under pressure13:31 Netanyahu and the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin15:27 The US’s military support for Israel16:32 The origins of Hamas20:20 Omer: Netanyahu’s coalition is “a mirror image of Hamas”24:45 The threat to democracy in Israel26:27 Omer: Netanyahu is driving the country to the right in order to avoid a corruption trial30:07 How “Jewish supremacists” have gained control of Israel’s government34:01 Why Omer’s Zionism does not commit him to defending Israel’s actions36:46 The risk of genocide in Gaza40:05 The IDF’s procedure in the Gaza invasion43:09 What will happen to the Gazan refugees?45:00 The international community’s role in finding a resolution to the Gaza War48:17 Is the IDF “the most moral army in the world”?54:39 The revenge motive57:07 Omer: The campaign in Gaza is a fiasco59:38 A US-led plan for “the day after”1:04:37 Is peace in Israel a pollyannaish pipe dream?Recorded January 2, 2023Links and ReadingsBenny Morris’s book, One State, Two States: Resolving the Israel-Palestine ConflictOmer’s New Statesman piece, “Both Netanyahu and Hamas see this crisis as an opportunity”Hamas’s 1988 charterOmer’s NYT op-ed, “What I Believe as a Historian of Genocide” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

I had planned to release the first Glenn and John episode of 2024 on New Year’s Day. Unfortunately, life had other plans, and John and I could not record as scheduled. So instead, my staff put together this collection of some of our favorite clips from 2023. John and I covered a lot of ground last year. Here you’ll see us addressing African American performance on standardized tests, the Supreme Court’s affirmative action decision, the riots of 2020, the Gaza War, and other big topics on the show.0:00 A New Year's message from Glenn2:36 How do we know that African Americans are just as smart as everyone else?11:15 Glenn goes in on the 2020 riots16:34 John: I love linguistics, but linguistics no longer loves me25:37 Glenn: How can anyone argue that race-based affirmative action doesn’t violate the 14th Amendment?34:58 When the smoke clears in Gaza45:34 John: “We’ve been lied to” about George Floyd’s death54:32 Glenn and John revisit their first conversation This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Philip’s early work on post-nuclear war recovery2:26 Philip’s skepticism toward the role of lawyers in the US4:34 What’s wrong with the EPA, OSHA, and the EEOC?6:59 How to ensure worker safety without “4,000 rules”8:07 Why the US spends so much on healthcare11:32 Philip: We’ve degenerated into a culture of distrust14:58 The origins of American distrust18:42 Re-instilling trust21:38 The problems of national security and public health26:57 Are public employee unions constitutional?39:35 Market constraints don’t hold for government employees34:55 Do public sector workers need protection from exploitation?39:22 Philip: “Public service is repellant to good candidates”40:58 A short history of the civil service46:49 Is Philip inveighing against the Democratic Party and the labor movement at large?53:12 Philip: Police unions prevent accountability, too56:08 The necessity of a constitutional solution to public unions1:00:58 Philip: The political organizing of public unions harms the public1:04:46 Would the current Supreme Court be receptive to Philip’s case?Recorded October 27, 2023Links and ReadingsPhilip’s book, The Death of Common Sense: How Law Is Suffocating AmericaPhilip’s book, Life Without Lawyers: Restoring Responsibility in AmericaPhilip’s latest book, Not Accountable: Rethinking the Constitutionality of Public Employee UnionsEdward Banfield’s book, The Moral Basis of a Backward SocietyRobert Putnam’s book, Making Democracy Work: Civic Traditions in Modern ItalyPhilip’s forthcoming book, Everyday Freedom: Designing the Framework for a Flourishing Society This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 How Liz and JC came to collaborate on their doc, The Fall of Minneapolis4:18 JC: No, the footage in the doc is not AI-manipulated6:08 How much of the body cam footage is previously unseen?8:18 Who lied about George Floyd, what did they lie about, and why?13:30 The relevance of Floyd’s behavior during the incident17:30 JC: Minneapolis Chief of Police Arradondo perjured himself22:30 Minnesota DA Keith Ellison’s email to Glenn24:11 The expert testimony from Dr. Martin Tobin on Floyd’s cause of death26:12 Adjudicating disputes about the cause of death34:36 Were racial justice tropes part of the Floyd incident?38:20 Why Liz and JC think Derek Chauvin didn’t get a fair trial41:28 Why JC didn’t include the entire viral video of Floyd in the doc44:30 What Chauvin told JC about the incident47:40 Humanizing the Minnesota police50:41 The aftermath of the Minneapolis riots55:32 The lawsuits that followed the Floyd family’s settlement56:34 The drugs that “complicated” Floyd’s restraintRecorded December 16, 2023.Links and ReadingsGlenn and John’s episode about The Fall of MinneapolisLiz and JC’s documentary, The Fall of MinneapolisLiz’s book, They're Lying: The Media, The Left, and The Death of George Floyd This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Tabia’s early career as a teacher5:40 Tabia’s “rough ride” as a DEI director17:06 The antisemitism problem at De Anza25:25 The inescapable BIPOC binary28:52 From disagreement to deplatforming35:30 Why Tabia found support among students but not faculty39:00 How attempts to silence Tabia backfired40:54 Tabia’s broad vision of diversity47:46 Learning from the medical professionals of GalileeRecorded November 27, 2023Links and ReadingsTabia’s New York Post piece, “I was a DEI director — DEI drives campus antisemitism”Tabia’s Compact piece, “A Black DEI Director Canceled by DEI”Foundation Against Intolerance and RacismDo No Harm MedicineCoalition for Empowered Education This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 A new documentary about George Floyd’s death raises new questions5:42 John: “We’ve been lied to” about George Floyd’s death14:27 The price of a “poetic truth”20:09 Was the Derek Chauvin jury intimidated into delivering a guilty verdict?23:26 Glenn: George Floyd was no hero29:03 The burning of Minneapolis’s 3rd Precinct34:54 Is there any hope of changing the George Floyd narrative?41:48 Who will take responsibility for changing things in black America?Recorded December 2, 2023Links and ReadingsGlenn and John’s May 2020 episode, “Cops and Race”Liz Collin and JC Chaix’s documentary, The Fall of MinneapolisEli and Shelby Steele’s documentary, What Killed Michael Brown?Barbershop, “OJ did it”Coleman Hughes’s forthcoming book, The End of Race Politics: Arguments for a Colorblind America This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit glennloury.substack.comGlenn and John answer Substack subscriber questions from November 2023.

0:00 Is “black heterodoxy” a euphemism for “black conservatism”?13:34 Classical liberalism’s role in Free Black Thought15:07 Erec: I saw things while working as a diversity officer that I can’t unsee22:47 Why the Democratic Party doesn’t like Erec30:38 How Free Black Thought is fostering agency in the black community36:16 Erec: The onus is on us, not affirmative action, to prepare black students for college45:19 What is rhetoric, anyway?Recorded November 13, 2023Links and ReadingsErec’s nonprofit, Free Black ThoughtJournal of Free Black ThoughtFree Black Thought’s podcastMinnesota’s Take Charge programThe Hidden Genius ProjectGlenn’s essay in the Journal of Free Black Thought, “Wrestle Not against Flesh and Blood” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 The state of campus speech after 10/75:48 Daniel: Why are critics of cancel culture silent when it comes to Israel?15:43 “Explaining” Hamas vs. “excusing” Hamas26:17 Tyler: American Jewish students worried about their safety have been primed by modern identity politics29:31 The tension between DEI and antisemitism response teams38:17 The linguistic ambiguity of “From the river to the sea”43:41 The irreconcilable conflict between campus social justice and donor funding47:49 If not liberalism, then what?53:51 Tyler: Postwar political conservatism is coming apartRecorded November 18, 2023Links and ReadingsDaniel’s podcast, American PrestigeGlenn’s conversation with Yascha Mounk (recorded October 3, 2023)Adam Shatz’s book, The Rebel’s Clinic: The Revolutionary Lives of Frantz FanonLisa Stampnitzky’s book, Disciplining Terror: How Experts Invented “Terrorism”Daniel’s essay in the Nation, “A Bad Breakup”Theodor Adorno and Max Horkheimer’s book, Dialectic of Enlightenment: Philosophical FragmentsDaniel’s Harper’s essay, “Empire Burlesque” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 How Bob gave Glenn his start in podcasting2:05 Is the Gaza War in Israel’s best interests …11:46 … and if not, what should Israel have done in response to October 7?18:06 How Hamas gained control of Gaza26:53 Bob: Some in the Israeli government wouldn’t mind a wider war in the Middle East36:46 What does “From the river to the sea” actually mean?46:10 Bob: Every settlement in the West Bank is a war crime54:20 The psychology of victimhood and retribution1:00:37 The challenge of spiritual transformationRecorded November 13, 2023Links and ReadingsBob’s Substack, the Nonzero NewsletterBrown University faculty’s call for a ceasefireGlenn’s conversation with John McWhorter, “Thinking Through the Gaza War”Bob’s Nonzero Newsletter piece, “The Truth about Hamas”John Judis’s 2013 New Republic piece, “Clueless in Gaza”John Judis and Ruy Texeira’s book, Where Have All the Democrats Gone?: The Soul of the Party in the Age of ExtremesBob’s Nonzero Newsletter piece, “The ‘River to the Sea’ Rorschach Test”Bob debates Eli Lake on Israel-PalestineJimmy Carter’s book, Palestine: Peace Not ApartheidBob’s book, Why Buddhism is True: The Science and Philosophy of Meditation and EnlightenmentThe documentary Disturbing the Peace This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:35 A quick announcement1:46 What led Yascha to write about identity6:22 An intellectual history of “identity synthesis”12:15 What’s so bad about “strategic essentialism”?19:15 From postmodernism to post-civil rights28:45 The three key claims of identity synthesis36:02 What led up to the summer of 2020?45:51 The hermetically sealed ideology of Kendi and DiAngelo50:45 Yascha’s defense of universalismRecorded October 3, 2023Links and ReadingsYascha’s new book, The Identity Trap: A Story of Ideas and Power in Our TimeMichel Foucault’s book, The Order of Things: An Archaeology of the Human SciencesEdward Said’s book, OrientalismGayatri Spivak’s essay, “Can the Subaltern Speak?”Glenn’s debate with Kmele Foster, Shelby Steele, Robert Woodson, and Reihan SalamKaren and Barbara Fields’s book, Racecraft: The Soul of Inequality in American LifeTommie Shelby’s book, We Who Are Dark: The Philosophical Foundations of Black SolidarityNoam Chomsky and Michel Foucault’s 1971 debate on Dutch televisionDerrick Bell’s book, Faces at the Bottom of the Well: The Permanence of RacismDerrick Bell’s essay, “Serving Two Masters: Integration Ideals and Client Interests in School Desegregation Litigation”Mahalia Jackson singing “We Shall Overcome”Roy D’Andrade’s article, “Moral Models in Anthropology” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Persia at the turn of the twentieth century6:43 Woodrow Wilson’s contradictions11:14 Did Howard Baskerville escape the prejudices of his time?16:39 How Baskerville got involved in Persia’s democratic revolution26:43 How Czar Nicholas II aided the counter-revolution32:29 The erasure of Baskerville in post-1979 Iran36:31 The theological origin of the Islamic Republic of Iran45:01 Reza: Ordinary Iranians actually love American culture48:51 The internal and external pressures on Iran57:21 The amorality of foreign policyRecorded October 25, 2023Links and ReadingsReza’s book, Zealot: The Life and Times of Jesus of NazarethReza’s new book, An American Martyr in Persia: The Epic Life and Tragic Death of Howard Baskerville This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit glennloury.substack.comGlenn and John answer subscriber questions.

0:00 Why John thinks pro-Hamas sentiment on the American left is racist 6:11 Distinguishing between anti-colonialism and antisemitism 12:46 There are great crimes in America’s past. But we shouldn’t let them define us.17:08 Glenn: We’re standing on the precipice of something catastrophic 27:57 John’s proposal for the US’s role in Israel’s domestic conflict 34:59 Is it right for people to lose their jobs over opposing Israel? 42:07 Why are pro-Hamas leftists supporting an anti-liberal regime? 47:01 Glenn and John’s responsibilities as teachers 52:26 What’s next on TGSRecorded October 28, 2023Links and ReadingsJohn’s Free Press piece, “The Ultimate Condescension Toward Palestinians”Adam Shatz’s LRB essay, “Vengeful Pathologies”Joe Biden’s Oval Office address on Israel and UkraineReza Aslan’s book, Zealot: The Life and Times of Jesus of NazarethReza Aslan’s new book, An American Martyr in Persia: The Epic Life and Tragic Death of Howard Baskerville This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Why John thinks Russia’s invasion of Ukraine was rational6:55 How small states deal with world powers10:13 If Russia’s action were rational, were the US’s?16:40 John: The Ukraine invasion violates international law, but Russia has reason to see it as just21:58 The risk of escalation29:26 Zelensky’s expert manipulation of the West33:51 Is it a coincidence that so many recent presidential scandals involve Ukraine?39:57 Can tolerant liberals tolerate illiberal societies?45:45 American Russophobia didn’t cause the war, but it’s not helping49:19 John: If Putin is overthrown, his replacement will probably be even more brutal53:35 The foreign policy establishment’s grip on both Democrats and RepublicansLinks and ReadingsJohn’s SubstackJohn’s book, with Sebastian Rosato, How States Think: The Rationality of Foreign PolicyJohn’s essay, “Bound to Lose” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 The blowback from Coleman’s TED Talk 8:50 Did TED intentionally throttle promotion for Coleman’s talk? 17:08 John’s trouble with TED while promoting Woke Racism 20:21 Coleman’s forthcoming book, The End of Race Politics: Arguments for a Colorblind America 29:17 Race in public and private life 43:49 Closure on the TED affair 45:14 What are the goals of each side in the Israel-Palestine conflict? 51:58 Will the Israeli military response simply restart the cycle of violence and resentment? 1:02:15 The threat of post-October 7 overreactionLinks and ReadingsColeman’s Substack, Coleman’s CornerColeman’s podcast, Conversations with ColemanColeman’s forthcoming book, The End of Race Politics: Arguments for a Colorblind AmericaColeman's conversation with Glenn Greenwald about the TED TalkColeman’s TED Talk, “A Case for Color Blindness”Coleman’s Free Press piece, “Why Is TED Scared of Color Blindness”Coleman’s conversation with Jamelle BouieGeroge Packer’s Atlantic piece, “Israel Must Not React Stupidly” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Introduction by Greg Burnep4:27 What does affirmative action mean in 2023?11:06 Randy’s distinction between “disadvantage” and “discrimination”18:21 Diversity’s double-talk31:18 Did the Supreme Court say discrimination is allowed at military academies?34:33 Glenn: Affirmative action distracts us from bigger problems41:16 Affirmative action is an elite problem48:48 Affirmative action as an insurance policy57:42 The stigmatization of affirmative action beneficiaries1:04:14 Glenn: Affirmative action has been a net positive, but it’s time to stop1:07:14 Q&A: Does historical injustice alone justify affirmative action?1:10:33 Q&A: Can and should colleges use loopholes to get around Students for Fair Admissions?1:14:50 Q&A: Does the “need” for affirmative action say something race or education?1:16:27 Q&A: What is the impact of SFFA beyond the university?1:23:35 Q&A: What about class-based affirmative action?Recorded September 20, 2023Links and ReadingsRandy’s book, Race, Crime, and the LawRandy’s book, For Discrimination: Race, Affirmative Action, and the LawGlenn’s conversation with Jay Caspian Kang This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit glennloury.substack.comGlenn and John answer subscriber questions.

0:00 What’s wrong with critical race theory, anyway? 3:31 Why “black Columbia” pretends that John doesn’t exist 12:08 CRT’s racial power-grab 18:06 Does the Jewish American example apply to African Americans? 23:10 Disguising failure as victimology 32:15 Why Dan thinks the CRT tide is ebbing 39:58 The schadenfreude of the Ibram X. Kendi scandal 51:00 John: “I’m embarrassed for Boston University” 56:40 Glenn: Kendi is just a cog in the fraudulent antiracist machine 1:04:31 The shame of the Kendi scandalRecorded September 30, 2023Links and ReadingsDan’s book, Toxic Diversity: Gender, Race, and Law Talk in AmericaFrantz Fanon’s book, The Wretched of the EarthAdam Schatz’s forthcoming biography, The Rebel’s Clinic: The Revolutionary Lives of Frantz FanonGlenn’s conversation with Norman FinkelsteinGlenn and John’s conversation with Don BatonGlenn and John’s conversation with James Beaman This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 How Sabby got her start on YouTube6:18 What happened to the Justice Democrats’ “hostile takeover”?11:31 Is the US sliding into fascism?19:26 The tension between race and class on the left27:15 Donald Trump’s rising popularity among black men32:39 The military-industrial complex and climate change42:07 Sabby’s argument for worker co-ops51:20 Finding (somewhat) common ground on immigration54:18 Demilitarizing the police is one thing, defunding the police is another59:46 Sabby: “We should not be giving money to Ukraine”1:04:35 How Sabby deals with disrespectful guestsRecorded September 16, 2023Links & ReadingsSabby’s YouTube pageRevolutionary Blackout Network’s YouTube pageSabby’s interview with Cornel WestAOC’s endorsement of Joe Biden on Pod Save AmericaJimmy Dore’s interview with Cornel WestSabby’s episode on Jimmy Dore-Cornel West interviewGlenn and John McWhorter’s conversation with Mark GoldblattGlenn’s debate with Richard WolffBriahana Joy Gray debates Krystal Ball and Kyle Kulinski This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Tyler’s concept of “racial gamification” 6:30 Affirmative action in spirit and practice 13:18 Why can’t we just determine admissions based on academic merit alone? 19:17 The fading popularity of “traditional” affirmative action 22:47 Re-weighting and funding the admissions process 32:28 How can we get white “allies” to act normal around black people? 38:23 Can we have interpersonal colorblindness without political colorblindness? 44:42 Tyler’s scholarly work about the end of humanity 48:10 Glenn prepares for his conversation with Sabrina SalvatiRecorded September 10, 2023Links and ReadingsTyler’s NYT piece, “I Teach at an Elite College. Here’s a Look Inside the Racial Gaming of Admissions”Tyler’s Atlantic piece, “I’m a Black Professor. You Don’t Need to Bring That Up.”Roland Fryer’s NYT piece, “How to Fix College Admissions Now”Glenn’s conversation with Jay Caspian KangJimmy Dore’s interview with Cornel WestJohn’s appearance on The View This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Biden’s new DEI initiatives7:59 The disparate uses of disparate impact13:59 Shep’s new book, The Crucible of Desegregation: The Uncertain Search for Educational Equality23:15 The problem with claims that education is resegregating29:56 Are we heading back to the bussing debates of the 1970s?35:52 Shep’s book, The Transformation of Title IX: Regulating Gender Equality in Education44:20 Glenn’s “uncle” objects to analogies between trans people and African Americans47:58 Shep: Banning Critical Race Theory is the wrong strategyRecorded September 8, 2023Links and ReadingsShep’s new book, The Crucible of Desegregation: The Uncertain Search for Educational EqualityHeather Mac Donald’s book, When Race Trumps Merit: How the Pursuit of Equity Sacrifices Excellence, Destroys Beauty, and Threatens LivesGary Orfield’s book, The Reconstruction of Southern Education: The Schools and the 1964 Civil Rights ActJames Fishkin’s book, Justice, Equal Opportunity, and the FamilyShep’s book, The Transformation of Title IX: Regulating Gender Equality in EducationJohn Skretny’s book, The Minority Rights RevolutionRobin DiAngelo’s book, White Fragility: Why It’s So Hard for White People to Talk about Racism This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Can a white man tell Harriet Tubman’s story?9:59 What the fall semester has in store for Glenn and John17:25 How John makes the sausage at the New York Times22:55 John: We now memorize rap lyrics instead of poetry36:18 Is wokeness on the wane?42:12 What John just doesn’t get about Carol Swain51:46 A Democrat by any other name56:50 John makes a wild prediction about TrumpRecorded August 31, 2023Links and ReadingsThe Philadelphia Harriet Tubman statueJohn’s NYT piece, “Two Languages Walk into a Bar”John’s NYT piece, “How Hip-Hop Became America’s Poetry”Oliver Anthony’s song, “Rich Men North of Richmond”Jason Aldean’s song, “Try That in a Small Town”Donald Trump’s mugshotSabrina Salvati’s YouTube channelCarol Swain’s recent TGS episodeCarol Swain’s book, Black Faces, Black Interests: The Representation of African Americans in CongressDinesh D’Souza’s film, 2000 MulesCarol Swain’s PragerU videos This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit glennloury.substack.com

0:00 Why Carol joined Black Voices for Trump9:59 Why should black people support Trump?16:31 Carol: Democrats stole the 2020 election26:07 Does Trump face a credible assassination threat?30:35 The redefinition of white supremacy35:51 Deracializing the crime debate39:58 Carol’s new book, The Adversity of Diversity: How Real Training Can Promote Healing in a Post-Affirmative Action World50:55 Glenn: Affirmative action is one thing, DEI is another1:04:54 Clarence Thomas v. Ketanji Brown Jackson1:08:06 What affirmative action did rightRecorded August 26, 2023Links and ReadingsCarol and Mike Towle’s new book, The Adversity of Diversity: How Real Training Can Promote Healing in a Post-Affirmative Action WorldCarol’s Godfather III Twitter (now X) postReuters story on Harrison FloydJason Riley’s book, The Black BoomTucker Carlson’s debate night interview with Donald TrumpCarol’s book, The New White Nationalism in America: Its Challenge to IntegrationCarol and Christopher J. Schorr’s book, Black Eye for America: How Critical Race Theory Is Burning Down the House This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 A sixteen-year-long conversation5:45 Race and socioeconomics on the cusp of the Obama Era21:19 The myth of black poverty and deindustrialization32:56 Glenn pulls rank37:59 Why Glenn changed his mind about the Manhattan Institute50:15 Is the think tank world any more “objective” than academia?Recorded August 19, 2023Links and ReadingsGlenn and John’s first conversation from November 7, 2007John’s book, Losing the Race: Self-Sabotage in Black AmericaJohn’s book, Winning the Race: Beyond the Crisis in Black AmericaGlenn’s book, The Anatomy of Racial InequalityMartin Peretz’s memoir, The Controversialist: Arguments with Everyone, Left, Right, and CenterJeffrey O.C. Ogbar’s book, Hip-Hop Revolution: The Culture and Politics of RapCharles Murray’s book, Losing Ground: American Social Policy, 1950-1980Charles Murray and Richard Herrnstein’s book, The Bell Curve: Intelligence and Class Structure in American Life This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Haim’s history with The Glenn Show7:54 How Haim ended up fighting in Ukraine17:42 The legionnaire’s lingua franca27:55 Haim’s riposte to Cornel West on Ukraine42:27 A pen in one hand and a gun in the other47:56 Haim: Ukraine’s sovereignty and national identity must be respected53:34 Is the two-state solution dead?Recorded July 23, 2023Links and ReadingsHaim’s writing for this newsletterHaim’s Substack, The GarlandGlenn’s recent conversation with Cornel WestHaim and Nikita Petrov’s exchange on the Ukraine WarNikita’s Substack, Psychopolitica This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 The protestant ethic and the spirit of wokeness 10:47 Is comparing wokeness to religion a slander on religion? 21:08 Ian: Wokeness is a distraction from real political problems 28:02 How Ian experienced his own cancelation 41:31 America’s exportation of wokeness 45:45 Has wokeness aided and abetted Trump and Brexit? 52:54 John: Enslaved people did find ways to improve their own livesRecorded August 7, 2023Links and ReadingsIan’s Harper’s piece, “Doing the Work”John’s book, Woke Racism: How a New Religion Has Betrayed Black AmericaJian Ghomeshi’s 2018 NYRB piece, “Reflections from a Hashtag”Tomiwa Owolade’s book, This is Not America: Why Black Lives in Britain MatterDavid Brooks’s NYT oped, “What if We’re the Bad Guys Here?”John’s NYT oped, “One Sentence Does Not Define a Curriculum”The Florida Board of Education’s 2023 standards for social studiesRobert Cherry’s essay on slavery at this newsletter This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit glennloury.substack.com

0:00 How Jay’s position on affirmative action changed12:15 Jay: I can’t see the virtue in affirmative action as it’s practiced20:07 Why did so many Asian students defend policies that discriminated against Asians?25:35 The hidden cultural argument in the California Mathematics Framework32:01 Is the “people of color coalition” coming apart?34:55 Why so little outrage over the SCOTUS affirmative action decision?42:26 When students internalize artificial trauma narratives49:06 America can’t economically decouple itself from China. Will anti-China rhetoric wane?55:49 What will and won’t change in the wake of Students for Fair Admissions v. Harvard1:05:29 Isn’t there some value to diversity in education?Recorded July 24, 2023Links and ReadingsJay’s New Yorker piece, “Why the Champions of Affirmative Action Had to Leave Asian Americans Behind”Jay’s book, The Loneliest AmericansJay’s podcast with E. Tammy Kim, Time to Say GoodbyeJay’s 2019 New York Times Magazine piece, “Where Does Affirmative Action Leave Asian-Americans?”Jennifer Lee and Min Zhou’s book, The Asian American Achievement ParadoxNatasha Warikoo’s book, Race at the Top: Asian Americans and Whites in Pursuit of the American Dream in Suburban SchoolsThe California Mathematics FrameworkRoland Fryer’s NYT piece, “How to Fix College Admissions Now” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Peter’s role in the Supreme Court affirmative action case8:57 Are legacy admissions affirmative action by another name?19:17 Why Peter got interested in affirmative action24:20 Glenn was for affirmative action before he was against it30:33 Peter: Universities are not honest about admissions34:20 The brilliance of Roland Fryer51:17 Campus diversity after affirmative actionRecorded July 22, 2023Links and ReadingsGlenn’s 2020 conversation with PeterPeter’s paper, “What happens after enrollment? An analysis of the time path of racial differences in GPA and major choice”Mary Sue Coleman on the steps of the Supreme CourtJohn’s book, Losing the Race: Self-Sabotage in Black AmericaRoland Fryer’s paper, “An Empirical Analysis of Racial Differences in Police Use of Force”Federico Echenique and Roland Fryer’s paper, “A Measure of Segregation Based on Social Interactions”David Austen-Smith and Roland Fryer’s paper, “The Economics of ‘Acting White’” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 How Matt first encountered Christopher Hitchens6:07 Matt’s new book, How Hitchens Can Save the Left: Rediscovering Fearless Liberalism in an Age of Counter-Enlightenment8:00 Why Matt thinks Cornel West’s Vietnam-Afghanistan analogy is flawed14:21 What’s worth preserving in the left-liberal tradition?21:38 Matt: Identity politics is a “toxin”27:20 Was affirmative action ever necessary?35:29 Matt: I wish the left would rediscover Hitchens’s universalism45:04 Hitchens’s “fearless liberalism”Recorded July 6, 2023Links and ReadingsMatt’s new book, How Hitchens Can Save the Left: Rediscovering Fearless Liberalism in an Age of Counter-EnlightenmentHitchens’s NYRB review of Douglas Murray’s Bosie: A Biography of Lord Alfred DouglasHitchens’s book, Why Orwell MattersGeorge Orwell’s book, Keep The Aspidistra FlyingGlenn’s recent conversation with Cornel WestMatt’s Quilette essay on John MearsheimerMatt’s Quillette essay on Bayard RustinJonathan Eig’s King: A LifeNathan Glazer’s book, Affirmative Discrimination: Ethnic Inequality and Public PolicyRoland Fryer’s NYT oped, “How to Fix College Admissions Now”Glenn’s debate with HitchensTa-Nehisi Coates’s Atlantic essay, “The Case for Reparations”Bayard Rustin’s 1965 Commentary essay, “From Protest to Politics: The Future of the Civil Rights Movement”Norman Finkelstein’s book, I’ll Burn That Bridge When I Come to It!: Heretical Thoughts on Identity Politics, Cancel Culture, and Academic FreedomGlenn’s conversation with Norman Finkelstein This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 John: Let’s be honest about what “taking race into account” means in affirmative action10:09 Glenn: How can anyone argue that race-based affirmative action doesn’t violate the 14th Amendment?19:29 Why are we so focused on elite institutions?24:32 John: The University of California works just fine without “racial preferences”30:28 “You’re pulling the ladder up behind you” is an invalid critique35:00 John: The fact that racism exists does not justify changing standards44:04 Why Roland Fryer thinks we should put our money where our mouth is on race and education51:04 Will the post-Students for Fair Admissions future turn into a “Hardship Olympics”?Recorded July 8, 2023Links and ReadingsZachary Bleemer’s paper, “Affirmative Action, Mismatch, and Economic Mobility after California’s Proposition 209”Zachary Bleemer’s paper, “Affirmative Action and Its Race-Neutral Alternatives”The Supreme Court opinions in Students for Fair Admissions v. HarvardJohn’s book, Losing the Race: Self-Sabotage in Black AmericaJohn’s NYT piece, “On Race and Academia”Roland Fryer’s NYT oped, “How to Fix College Admissions Now” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit glennloury.substack.com

0:00 The problem with scientific consensus6:36 Why Jay and his colleagues were branded “fringe epidemiologists”15:52 Jay: We need to engage with everyone—even those with mistaken beliefs25:55 Persuading science skeptics36:04 How do we stop COVID overreach from happening again?46:38 Jay: Gain-of-function research is impossible to do safely55:03 Are some ideas too dangerous to test?59:30 Jay: Fauci’s blunder was so catastrophic that only history can judge himRecorded June 23, 2023Links and ReadingsRav Arora and Jay’s newsletter, The Illusion of ConsensusDoris Kearns Goodwin’s book, Team of Rivals: The Political Genius of Abraham LincolnThe Great Barrington DeclarationSteve Koonin’s book, Unsettled: What Climate Science Asks Us, What It Doesn’t, and Why It MattersSteve Koonin’s TGS appearanceTjalling Koopman’s, Three Essays on the State of Economic ScienceEmily Oster’s Atlantic piece, “Let’s Declare a Pandemic Amnesty”The Norfolk Group DocumentGlenn’s paper, “Self-Censorship in Public Discourse: A Theory of ‘Political Correctness’ and Related Phenomena”Richard Feynman demonstrates flaws in Challenger’s O-ringsRoger Shattuck’s book, Forbidden Knowledge: From Prometheus to Pornography This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Why Cornel is running for president10:45 How Cornel links American militarism abroad and inequality at home15:15 Cornel’s pitch to skeptical right-of-center voters20:30 Is there tension between Cornel’s commitment to stopping climate change and his commitment to helping the working class?33:50 The moral potential and pitfalls of capitalism37:34 Might Cornel inadvertently hand the election to the Republicans?41:44 Cornel: Tim Scott and Clarence Thomas are wrong, but they’re sincere46:06 Why Cornel thinks the US is partially culpable for the Ukraine War52:04 Should Palestinians recognize the legitimacy of the State of Israel?1:00:23 Cornel’s ideas about the US borderRecorded on June 16, 2023Links and ReadingsCornel’s campaign websiteCornel’s TGS appearance with Teodros KirosGlenn and Richard Wolff debate capitalism and socialismCornel and Robert George on PBS’s Firing LineSteve Koonin’s TGS appearanceErnesto Cortes’s TGS appearanceBenjamin Schwartz and Christopher Layne’s Harper’s essay, “Why Are We in Ukraine?” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The following bonus episode was previously available only to paying Substack subscribers. We’re now releasing it to the public. 0:00 Identitarianism in the medical profession5:13 The (exaggerated) psychiatric toll of Covid7:31 Why were psychiatrists publicly diagnosing Trump?12:29 Sally’s quest for a kidney donor23:30 How the kidney donation system works and why it doesn’t29:30 The ethics of selling a kidney34:42 Can we put a price on the human body?43:44 Would paying donors exploit the poor?48:17 Is paid kidney donation a political possibility?53:12 The roadblocks facing paid kidney donationLinks and ReadingsSally’s book, P.C., M.D.: How Political Correctness Is Corrupting MedicineChristina Hoff Sommers and Sally’s book, One Nation Under Therapy: How the Helping Culture is Eroding Self-ReliancePeter Kramer and Sally’s 2017 NYT op-ed, “Who Decides Whether Trump Is Unfit to Govern?”matchingdonors.comLeon Kass’s book, Life, Liberty, and the Defense of Dignity: The Challenge for BioethicsGlenn’s conversation with Michael SandelMichael Novak’s defense of paid kidney donation in First ThingsSally’s book, When Altruism Isn’t Enough: The Case for Compensating Kidney DonorsSally’s New York Times Magazine piece, “Desperately Seeking a Kidney”Sally’s website This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Why Jonathan’s course “Culture in America” got canceled 9:07 The fragility of liberal arts education 17:24 Managing “CRT zealots” in the classroom 27:44 Is there a future for free inquiry? 35:03 John: Black middle-class students don’t need affirmative action 44:57 Is diversity the problem, or is it elitism? 52:35 The virtues (and virtue signaling) of Randall KennedyRecorded June 17, 2023Links and ReadingsAlex Morey and Nadine Strossen’s FIRE article about Jonathan, “Who’s Allowed to Teach ‘Culture in America’?”Barnard’s Center for Engaged PedagogyJohn’s book, Woke Racism: How a New Religion Has Betrayed Black AmericaRobin DiAngelo’s book, White Fragility: Why It’s So Hard for White People to Talk about RacismCornell Belcher’s book, A Black Man in the White House: Barack Obama and the Triggering of America’s Racial-Aversion CrisisRichard Rothstein’s Atlantic piece, “The Problem with Wealth-Based Affirmative Action”John’s guest post, “Racial Preferences May End, but the Fight Will Continue”Derrick Bell’s book, Faces at the Bottom of the Well: The Permanence of RacismGlenn’s City Journal essay, “Affirmative Distraction”Randall Kennedy NYT guest essay, “The Truth Is, Many Americans Just Don’t Want Black People to Get Ahead”Randall Kennedy’s Atlantic essay, “My Race Problem”Randall Kennedy’s book, For Discrimination: Race, Affirmative Action, and the LawRandall Kennedy’s book, Nigger: The Strange Career of a Troublesome WordJohn McWhorter and Randall Kennedy on The Glenn ShowJohn’s 2008 Bloggingheads conversation with Randall Kennedy This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Bob’s new book, The State of the Black Family: Sixty Years of Tragedies and Failures—and New Initiatives Offering Hope7:02 Bob: “Liberals have given up” on changing black family dynamics15:02 Two-parent families are preferable, but single-parent families need help22:01 Do children help women organize their lives more effectively than men?29:14 Is community college helping or hurting young black men?38:38 How Bob thinks police and communities should deter violence45:42 Work requirements with a human face56:04 The moderate’s dilemmaRecorded May 4, 2023Links and ReadingsBob’s new book, The State of the Black Family: Sixty Years of Tragedies and Failures—and New Initiatives Offering HopeDaniel Patrick Moynihan’s report, The Negro Family: The Case for National ActionHerbert Gutman’s book, The Black Family in Slavery and Freedom, 1750-1925Lawrence Mead’s book, Beyond Entitlement: The Social Obligations of CitizenshipLawrence Mead on TGS This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Inside the mind of a crack columnist4:19 The blowback from Norman Finkelstein’s TGS appearance15:27 Is it enough to be a “happy warrior” for your cause?28:45 How did MLK become MLK?37:37 What’s in a name when that name is “Woodrow Wilson”?49:10 Glenn: “Clarence Thomas’s name should be on public school buildings”Recorded May 30, 2023Links and ReadingsJohn’s NYT archiveNorman Finkelstein on TGSNorman Finkelstein’s book, I’ll Burn That Bridge When I Come to It: Heretical Thoughts on Identity Politics, Cancel Culture, and Academic FreedomJonathan Eig’s new biography of Martin Luther King, King: A LifeJonathan Eig’s biography of Muhammad Ali, Ali: A LifeCharles Johnson’s novel, Middle PassageCharles Johnson’s novel, DreamerReza Aslan’s new book, An American Martyr in Persia: The Epic Life and Tragic Death of Howard BaskervillePBS’s Frontline documentary, Clarence and Ginni This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Charles’s argument for emphasizing education over systemic racism5:21 Donique: Teaching African American history doesn’t require critical race theory15:36 Charles: We are the 97%!18:48 How Donique balances oppression and triumph in black history24:02 What does Florida’s Stop WOKE Act actually say?33:30 What’s wrong with integrating LGBT history and black history?44:19 Sexuality’s ever-shifting Overton window49:40 Why Donique, a public school teacher, advocates for homeschooling54:30 Expanding the canon of historic black figuresRecorded April 10, 2023Links and ReadingsCharles’s podcast, Cut the BullSeeking Educational ExcellenceThe Woodson Center’s 1776 Unites projectPutting the Pieces TogetherIan Rowe’s book, Agency: The Four Point Plan (F.R.E.E.) for ALL Children to Overcome the Victimhood Narrative and Discover Their Pathway to Power This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit glennloury.substack.com

0:00 John: “I love linguistics, but it no longer loves me”9:44 How Glenn and John are getting written out of their fields19:27 Jordan Neely didn’t deserve to die …27:28 … but the New York subway is getting scary37:45 Glenn: Reparations would be “impractical, unfair, and divisive in the extreme”50:50 A possible left-wing objection to reparations57:22 Glenn goes ham on reparationsRecorded May 18, 2023Links and ReadingsSteven Pinker’s book, The Language Instinct: How the Mind Creates LanguageJohn’s book, Talking Back, Talking Black: Truths about America’s Lingua FrancaJohn’s book, Word on the Street: Debunking the Myth of “Pure” Standard EnglishJohn’s language podcast, Lexicon ValleyJohn, Our Magnificent B*****d Tongue: The Untold History of EnglishJohn’s NYT piece about Jordan Neely, “A Killing on the F Train”Ta-Nehisi Coates’s 2014 Atlantic essay, “The Case for Reparations”Matthew Desmond’s book, Evicted: Poverty and Profit in the American CityMatthew Desmond’s new book, Poverty, by AmericaGlenn’s conversation with Norman FinkelsteinAugust Wilson’s play, Two Trains Running This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Why YouTube censored a TGS episode6:25 How can YouTube justify censoring matters of opinion?15:15 Why there’s no such thing as free speech26:00 Nikita’s notes on Substack Notes39:53 Democratizing content moderation46:11 Creating better, community-centered comments sectionsRecorded May 4, 2023Links and ReadingsNikita’s Substack, PsychopoliticaThe censored TGS episode, “I Feel, Therefore I Am”Glenn’s paper, “Self-Censorship in Public Discourse: A Theory of ‘Political Correctness’ and Related Phenomena”Matt Taibbi’s Substack, Racket NewsSubstack NotesGlenn’s most recent conversation with Amy Wax This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Has Norman been shut out of mainstream political debates?7:54 Norman’s conflict with Alan Dershowitz16:50 Is Israel an apartheid state?19:25 Identifying with Paul Robeson33:08 Norman’s new book, I’ll Burn That Bridge When I Get to It!44:42 Norman: Wokeness is a “triple scam”53:28 What’s become of Angela Davis?1:00:05 Cornel West's chosen path1:09:01 Obama’s self-proclaimed “neat trick”1:24:38 The political intelligence of Carter, Clinton, and Obama1:38:10 South Carolina 2020: a case study in identity politics1:47:24 Would Bernie have won in 2016?Recorded April 19, 2023Links and ReadingsNorman’s new book, I’ll Burn That Bridge When I Get to It!: Heretical Thoughts on Identity Politics, Cancel Culture, and Academic FreedomNorman’s book, The Holocaust Industry: Reflections on the Exploitation of Jewish SufferingNorman’s book, Beyond Chutzpah: On the Misuse of Anti-Semitism and the Abuse of HistoryNorman’s book, Gaza: An Inquest into Its MartyrdomNorman’s book, A Nation on Trial: The Goldhagen Thesis and Historical TruthNorman’s book, What Ghandi Says: On Nonviolence, Resistance, and CourageNorman’s book, “This Time We Went Too Far”: Truth and Consequences on the Gaza InvasionNorman’s book, Knowing Too Much: Why the American Jewish Romance with Israel is Coming to an EndNorman’s book, The Rise and Fall of Palestine: A Personal Account of the Intifada YearsJoan Peters’s book, From Time Immemorial: The Origins of the Arab-Jewish Conflict over PalestineAlan Dershowitz’s book, The Case for IsraelAlan Dershowitz and Norman’s debate on Democracy NowMichael Barnett, Nathan Brown, Marc Lynch, and Shibley Telhami’s Foreign Affairs piece, “Israel’s One-State Reality”Paul Robeson singing “The Four Insurgent Generals”The Letters of Rosa LuxembourgMark Doss performing “Ol’ Man River”Paul Robeson’s autobiography, Here I StandW.E.B. Du Bois’s book, The Philadelphia NegroW.E.B. DuBois’s book, Black Reconstruction in America, 1860-1880Tom Wolfe’s New York Magazine essay, “Radical Chic: That Party at Lenny’s”Angela Davis’s 2022 appearance at the University of South CarolinaBarack Obama’s memoir, A Promised LandBill Clinton’s memoir, My LifeJimmy Carter’s memoir, Keeping FaithDavid Axelrod’s memoir, Believer: My Forty Years in PoliticsFrederick Douglass’s third autobiography, Life and Times of Frederick Douglass This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

In this week’s episode, John and I return to a familiar character: Omar. For those of you unfamiliar with “Omar,” he’s our invented surrogate for the kind of young black man whose behavior is wreaking havoc on Chicago and St. Louis. Omar is economically disadvantaged. He was more than likely raised by a single mother. He underperforms academically, and he may have dropped out of high school. He’s involved in illegal activity of one sort or another. If there is some kind of large-scale disorderly event, you’ll likely find Omar there. After a discussion of Tucker Carlson’s departure from Fox News, John and I spend most of the episode talking about Omar: what made him who he is, why he acts the way he does, and what, if anything, can make him change. John has little sympathy for structural explanations for Omar’s behavior. According to John, culture makes Omar who he is, not the history of American racism, not implicit bias, and not even a supposed lack of legitimate jobs. I play devil’s advocate, raising some objections you might hear from sociologists or historians, but in truth, I find John’s reasoning pretty persuasive. To couch it in my own framework, the bias narrative just doesn’t cut it. And to those of you wondering if I have anything more to say about YouTube’s removal of my conversation with John and Mark Goldblatt: I sure do. I’ve recorded an episode with my creative director Nikita Petrov in which we discuss censorship, YouTube, and why we’re sticking with Substack. Stay tuned. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Featured Content from City JournalHad he been in treatment, Jordan Neely’s death in a subway car may have been prevented, writes Stephen Eide.0:00 Glenn mounts a defense of Tucker Carlson13:44 Glenn: “Race relations will not get better through denial”24:37 What historical conditions created Omar?36:24 John: Omar is not the result of white neglect45:16 John’s critique of structural explanations of Omar54:14 What will happen to Tucker? 55:40 Why you should become a paying subscriber Links and Readings The NYT’s story on Tucker Carlson’s “it’s not how white men fight” textJohn’s book, Winning the Race: Beyond the Crisis in Black AmericaWilliam Julius Wilson’s book, The Truly Disadvantaged: The Inner City, the Underclass, and Public PolicyWilliam Julius Wilson’s book, When Work Disappears: The World of the New Urban PoorWilliam Julius Wilson’s book, The Declining Significance of Race: Blacks and Changing American InstitutionsThomas Sugrue’s book, The Origins of the Urban Crisis: Race and Inequality in Postwar DetroitJason DeParle’s book, American Dream: Three Women, Ten Kids, and a Nation’s Drive to End WelfareFrantz Fanon’s book, The Wretched of the EarthFrantz Fanon’s book, Black Skin, White MasksPhilip Roth’s novel, American Pastoral This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Heather’s new book, When Race Trumps Merit: How the Pursuit of Equity Sacrifices Excellence, Destroys Beauty, and Threatens Lives8:20 Are racial disparities in medical school the result of racism or skills gaps?20:03 Do we really know what causes racial disparities?32:23 Closing racial achievement gaps begins at home40:39 Will black doctors necessarily provide better care to black patients?50:26 Canceling Western art1:00:37 Heather: Colonialism cannot explain the development of art1:05:21 The stupidity of arguments against “cultural appropriation”1:18:24 Heather: Lack of policing is a civil rights problem1:29:43 Is it possible for a cop to get a fair trial?1:34:40 Race and the future of progressive DAsRecorded April 16, 2023Links and ReadingsHeather’s new book, When Race Trumps Merit: How the Pursuit of Equity Sacrifices Excellence, Destroys Beauty, and Threatens LivesStephen Carter’s book, Reflections of an Affirmative Action BabyGlenn’s conversation with Charles MurrayCharles Murray’s book, Facing Reality: Two Truths about Race in AmericaJennifer Lee and Min Zhou’s book, The Asian American Achievement ParadoxRonald Ferguson’s learning network, The BasicsPierre Bourdieu’s book, DistinctionHeather’s City Journal essay, “Stirring Sounds”Michelle Alexander’s book, The New Jim Crow: Mass Incarceration in the Age of ColorblindnessMichael Fortner’s book, Black Silent Majority: The Rockefeller Drug Laws and the Politics of PunishmentGlenn’s conversation with Michael FortnerJames Forman Jr.’s book, Locking Up Our Own: Crime and Punishment in Black AmericaFred Siegal’s City Journal essay, “The Riot Ideology, Reborn” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit glennloury.substack.comGlenn and John answer questions from the Substack community.

0:00 Mark Goldblatt’s recent book, I Feel, Therefore I Am: The Triumph of Woke Subjectivism10:55 Wokeism’s roots in postmodern thought15:05 The “mysticism” of woke thinking17:44 Learning from Christine Blasey Ford’s accusations26:29 John breaks his silence on transgender issues35:13 The political consequences of subjectivism41:46 Why Mark thinks transgender people are mentally disordered50:07 What does the T have to do with the LGB?58:09 Mark: Transgender people deserve respect1:02:39 Distinguishing between strategy and realityLinks and ReadingsMark’s book, I Feel Therefore I Am: The Triumph of Woke SubjectivismMatt Yglesias’s Vox essay, “The Great Awokening”A clip from Glenn’s recent appearance on Real Time with Bill Maher This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 The gigification of academia8:26 Is education just another commodity?18:14 What do historians do?26:22 Daniel: The university system is an unregulated cartel35:08 The liberalism (not the leftism) of the university38:22 Using (and getting used by) new technology43:19 An alternate history of global economic development47:29 The end of the American century54:27 Daniel’s critique of US support for UkraineRecorded February 7, 2023Links and ReadingsDaniel’s NYT op-ed, “The Dangerous Decline of the Historical Profession”Daniel’s TGS mini-series, “Glenn Loury’s Intellectual Origins”Francis Fukuyama’s book, The End of History and the Last ManDaniel’s essay on Fukuyama for the Nation, “A Bad Breakup”Adrianna Kezar, Tom DePaola, and Daniel T. Scott’s book, The Gig Academy: Mapping Labor in the Neoliberal UniversitySamuel Bowles and Herbert Gintis’s book, Schooling in Capitalist America: Educational Reform and the Contradictions of Economic LifeJames Sweet’s column, “Is History History?”Daniel’s Chronicle of Higher Education piece, “The AHA’s Mission Needs to Change”Eugen Weber’s book, Peasants into Frenchmen: The Modernization of Rural France, 1870-1914Daniel’s podcast, American PrestigeDaniel’s Harper’s Harper’s piece, “Empire Burlesque”Daniel’s New Republic piece, “Does American Fascism Exist? This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Al Sharpton’s National Action Network still exists, apparently5:00 MLK’s understanding of America’s contributions to democracy12:58 Are the “people with three names” grifters or merely limited in their racial vision?21:07 How do you change the minds of black voters?30:13 The national black leadership vacuum36:30 The under-recognized success of the black middle class41:30 Ian’s got a four-point plan …47:38 … but what’s the best way to disseminate it? (It’s podcasts.)51:37 The paradox of Obama and Thomas1:01:01 How does Glenn know “nobody is coming to save us”?Recorded April 9, 2023Links and ReadingsIan’s book, Agency: The Four Point Plan (F.R.E.E.) for ALL Children to Overcome the Victimhood Narrative and Discover Their Pathway to PowerIan’s charter school network, Vertex Partnership AcademiesAl Sharpton’s National Action NetworkPew poll on black political strategy and leadershipAEI’s study, “Black Men: Making It in America” Richard Reeves’s book, Of Boys and Men: Why the Modern Male Is Struggling, Why It Matters, and What to Do about ItThomas Sowell speaking at the 1980 Fairmont ConferenceClarence Thomas’s memoir, My Grandfather’s Son  This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 What’s wrong with cancelation?13:28 A defense of Charles Murray21:24 Cancelation and the closet28:08 Jonathan’s book, The Constitution of Knowledge: A Defense of Truth39:35 Jonathan: “The marketplace of ideas” is a necessary but insufficient metaphor42:51 Is Trump an agent of disinformation?54:22 What the woke and MAGA crowds have in common59:41 Why Jonathan is hopeful about the constitution of knowledgeRecorded February 6, 2022Links and ReadingsJonathan’s latest book, The Constitution of Knowledge: A Defense of TruthJonathan’s book, Kindly Inquisitors: The New Attacks on Free ThoughtCharles Murray and Richard Herrnstein’s book, The Bell Curve: Intelligence and Class Structure in American LifeJeff Gerth’s Four-Party Columbia Journalism Review series on Trump and the pressStanford’s Internet Observatory This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 The disruption of Judge Kyle Duncan’s speech at Stanford Law School9:33 Why did people have a problem with Duncan?13:51 Will the current Supreme Court overturn Obergefell v. Hodges16:37 The necessity of free inquiry and reasoned discourse26:44 What it’s like being a FedSoc conservative at Stanford Law34:30 The fallout from the Duncan protests41:30 The vulgarity of the insults hurled at Duncan50:00 The role of conservatives at StanfordRecorded March 26, 2022Links and ReadingsVideo of Stanford Law School Associate Dean Tirien Steinbach responding to Judge DuncanStanford Law School Dean Jenny Martinez’s letter about the Duncan eventJohn Stuart Mill’s book, On Liberty This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This is a free preview of a paid episode. To hear more, visit glennloury.substack.comGlenn and John respond to questions from Substack subscribers.

0:00 John’s recent appearance on Real Time with Bill Maher7:23 The rigors of the lecture circuit10:29 The difference between equity and equality22:10 How do we know that African Americans are just as smart as everyone else?30:59 The new black bourgeoisie38:33 Standards in the arts are relative. But how relative?51:15 John sets the record straight on his dancing skillsRecorded March 19, 2022Links and ReadingsJohn’s most recent appearance on Real Time with Bill MaherGlenn and John April 14 UATX event in New YorkE. Franklin Frazier’s book, Black Bourgeoisie Glenn and John’s conversation with pseudonymous orchestra conductor Don BatonDon Baton’s Substack, The PodiumGlenn and John’s conversation with actor James BeamanJames Beaman’s Substack, The CornfieldGlenn and John’s conversation with Vincent LloydJohn’s NYT piece, “The High Art of Musical Theater”Walter Murphy’s song, “A Fifth of Beethoven” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

My guest this week is the distinguished physicist Sylvester “Jim” Gates. Jim was my colleague at Brown for years (he’s now at the University of Maryland), and we’re both alumni of MIT. Jim has made pathbreaking contributions to areas of physics that laymen like me can barely understand—he’s a deep, deep guy. He’s also got some thoughts on race and diversity in the sciences that give us an opportunity for some friendly debate. Jim begins by introducing supersymmetry, a subfield in physics he helped to define back in the ‘70s. It’s extremely complex stuff, but he breaks it down. We spend the bulk of our time, though, talking about race in the sciences. Jim stresses the value that diversity plays in an under-recognized aspect of scientific innovation: imagination. In Jim’s view, while tests are important, there are limits to what they can tell us about who is most likely to produce the next big advance in any scientific field, just as there are limits to what tests can tell us about the competency of any given student. He uses himself as an example of a student who was average when he started grad school but managed to transform himself into a cutting-edge researcher. He sees value in giving weight to diversity, and even to continuing affirmative action, but there are limits. He worries, for example, that DEI initiatives classifying basic practices like homework and demanding excellence as “white” are going too far, just as he thinks speakers with unpopular views should be met with debate rather than cancelation. It’s a pleasure to sit down with a scientist as distinguished as Jim Gates. I think you’ll be seeing more of him on The Glenn Show in the future. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Featured Content from the Manhattan InstituteImproving our criminal-justice system means spending the requisite money to address America’s horrific and long-standing problem with criminal violence, argue Reihan Salam and Charles Fain Lehman.0:00 What led Jim to the forefront of physics 7:53 Jim explains supersymmetry 11:50 Is there racism in the sciences? 18:12 The role of culture and imagination in the sciences 28:47 The scientific “big bang” in Europe 33:03 How Jim accounts for racial disparities in test scores 49:35 Jim: “Genius” is a verb 54:18 Why Jim worries about DEI and cancelationRecorded February 6, 2023Links and ReadingsClarence Williams’s book, Technology and the Dream: Reflections on the Black Experience at MIT, 1941-1999Jim’s essay, “Equity vs. Excellence: A False Dichotomy in Science and Society”Thomas Kuhn, The Structure of Scientific RevolutionsKarl Popper, The Logic of Scientific DiscoveryPhysicist Stephon Alexander’s TGS appearanceStephon Alexander’s book, The Jazz of Physics: The Secret Link between Music and the Structure of the UniverseStephon Alexander’s book, Fear of a Black Universe: An Outsider’s Guide to the Future of Physics This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 John’s awkward run-in at the farmer’s market 5:40 Will people be reading Ibram X. Kendi in 2043? 17:03 Regret, doubt, and going against the tide  28:12 How Glenn and John negotiate their public profiles 40:50 Did Scott Adams deserve to get canceled?  52:47 What’s going on beneath the Scott Adams controversy?Recorded March 5, 2023Links and ReadingsIbram X. Kendi’s Zora Neale Hurston adaptation, Magnolia FlowerMelissa Harris Perry’s radio show, The TakeawayIshmael Reed’s novel, Reckless EyeballingIshmael Reed’s essay collection, Another Day at the Front This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Oded's new book, The Journey of Humanity: The Origins of Wealth and Inequality7:58 How inequality and growth emerged over the course of human history18:52 Breaking free of a 300,000-year-old stagnation cycle27:24 Humanity's phase shift into modernity33:39 Inequality and the formation of institutions44:18 The deep links between geography and institutions50:38 Africa, Asia, and the trials of diversityRecorded January 21, 2023Links and ReadingsOded’s new book, The Journey of Humanity: The Origins of Wealth and Inequality This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Woke religion or woke cult? 8:59 Does suffering confer authority on the sufferer? 12:47 A world without “anti-black domination” 21:27 Is there an alternative to the criminal justice system? 34:42 Domination and the purpose of the university 42:47 How Vincent’s Telluride Association seminar blew up 50:45 The narrowness of the social justice framework 54:14 Glenn and John’s encounters with fans 59:49 Should Black Studies exist?Recorded February 19, 2023Links and ReadingsVincent’s latest book, Black Dignity: The Struggle against DominationVincent’s Compact essay, “A Black Professor Trapped in Anti-Racist Hell”John’s NYT piece, “DeSantis May Have Been Right” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Glenn Loury & Delano Squires (Blaze Media)0:00 Why Delano is a conservative7:06 Delano’s critique of Raphael Warnock and the “Afristocracy” 19:26 Delano: “The designer is the definer” 27:43 Abortion and black lives41:44 Are abortion rights necessary to protect women’s rights? 47:53 Delano: Government is no substitute for fatherhood53:48 Can we reweave the social fabric?Links and ReadingsDelano’s writing at Blaze MediaThe Woodson Center’s 1776 Unites Black and Married with KidsIan Rowe’s book, Agency: The Four Point Plan (F.R.E.E.) for ALL Children to Overcome the Victimhood Narrative and Discover Their Pathway to Power This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 The “utter horror show” and incompetent policing of the Tyre Nichols killing7:52 The relatively peaceful reaction to the killing15:25 What set off the cops?21:53 Why Peter thinks police units like SCORPION should not be disbanded27:25 Should we get rid of qualified immunity?30:21 Policing and white supremacy40:45 Peter: We on the left have ceded law and order to the Trumpian right46:00 Tyre Nichols’s funeral53:59 John: I disagree with Sharpton, Crump, and Dyson, but they’re sincereLinks and ReadingsVideo of Memphis police officers beating Tyre NicholsAl Sharpton’s eulogy for NicholsBenjamin Crump speaks at Nichols’s funeralOfficial trailer for Spike Lee’s film, Bamboozled This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Ernie’s work as an organizer5:45 Tension, polarization, and reconciliation12:49 The drama of organizing18:21 The definition of power27:52 Ernesto’s work getting running water and sewers to border communities31:26 Market activity vs. market ideology41:31 What’s wrong with meritocracy?56:12 Does identitarianism stand in the way of reconciliation?Recorded January 19, 2023Links and ReadingsIndustrial Areas FoundationMy recent debate with Richard WolffArthur Okun’s book, Equality and Efficiency: A Big TradeoffDaniel Bell’s book, The Cultural Contradictions of CapitalismJohn Kenneth Galbraith’s book, American Capitalism: The Concept of Countervailing PowerMichael Sandel’s book, The Tyranny of Merit: What’s Become of the Common Good?Michael Sandel’s book, What Money Can’t Buy: The Moral Limits of MarketsMichael Sandel’s TGS appearanceFranz Fanon’s book, Black Skin, White Masks This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Glenn and John go to Cambridge9:25 The Hamline University Prophet Muhammad controversy 14:38 John: “Physics is physics”18:45 The Harlem Renaissance and Black Studies26:35 Is “getting past race” more trouble than it’s worth?36:51 Is Joe Biden patronizing black people?42:59 How a black musical changed the sound of Broadway Recorded January 20, 2023Links and ReadingsThe Equiano ProjectArnold Rampersand’s biography of Langston HughesJohn’s 2002 City Journal piece, “The Mau-Mauing at Harvard”Glenn and John’s recent conversation with Greg ThomasCaseen Gaines’s book, When Broadway Was Black This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Steven’s best-selling book, Unsettled: What Climate Science Tells Us, What It Doesn’t, and Why It Matters2:38 Steven: Concerns about catastrophic climate change “beggar belief”9:43 The complexities of climate change models15:07 Should we worry about rising sea levels?24:54 Hurricanes, tornados, and other extreme weather events29:59 Is a zero-emissions goal worth the cost?38:05 How to fix climate science45:02 Are the Paris Accords viable?48:13 The coming climate backlashRecorded January 3, 2023Links and ReadingsSteven’s book, Unsettled: What Climate Science Tells Us, What It Doesn’t, and Why It MattersSteven’s recent Wall Street Journal op-ed, “Will Climate Change Really Put New York Underwater?”Steven’s 2022 Wall Street Journal op-ed, “Greenland’s Melting Ice Is No Cause for Climate-Change Panic” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 A brief intro from Glenn1:03 The lionization of the lightweights5:45 The unified field theory of non-whiteness19:16 An honest conversation about crime27:51 Glenn’s birthday menu30:46 It’s time to choose a side41:46 Clarence Thomas, black icon44:54 Policing Joe Rogan51:56 By any means necessary? This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week I’m very pleased to have with me the political philosopher Michael Sandel. I’ve been an avid reader of Michael’s work for decades, ever since coming across his first book, Liberalism and the Limits of Justice in the 1980s. Michael’s latest book, 2020’s The Tyranny of Merit, couldn’t be more timely. In it, Michael elaborates a critique of the meritocratic ideology that divides society into winners and losers, each of which has earned the fate that has befallen them. In our conversation, Michael lays out his argument in the book, which takes issue with the notion that an individual’s economic success or failure is an index of their character. The idea that the wealthy deserve their wealth and the poor deserve their poverty ignores the powerful economic forces that shape the outcomes of people’s lives, forces that operate well outside the control of the people affected by them. We discuss the distinction between profit and value, and the ways that the cultural and economic rise of tech, finance, and knowledge work has stripped the dignity and honor from formerly dignified and honorable professions. The rise of populism since Trump’s election serves as compelling evidence that society’s “losers” recognize the bad hand they’ve been dealt, but Michael’s critique of meritocracy has made him an influential figure in China as well, where meritocracy is arguably an even more powerful cultural force. It’s an honor to have such a distinguished figure on the show. I have the feeling that what Michael says here will ring true for many of my listeners, so I’m looking forward to your comments. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Featured Content from City JournalSteven Malanga discusses why the middle class flees states that tax the rich. 0:00 Some of Michael’s key works 4:01 Meritocratic ideals and meritocratic fantasies 10:07 The animus against elites 16:26 Shouldn’t innovators reap their rewards? 23:09 Does more profit create more value? 28:42 Renewing the dignity of work 37:43 The uses of punishment 43:57 Our responsibility to national and global communities 46:17 Michael: Diversity has “monopolized” discussion of affirmative action 52:52 China’s reception of Michael’s critique of meritocracyRecorded November 18, 2022Links and Readings Michael’s book, Liberalism and the Limits of JusticeMichael’s book, What Money Can’t Buy: The Moral Limits of Markets Michael’s book, The Tyranny of Merit: Can We Find the Common Good?Michael Young’s book, The Rise of the MeritocracyIndustrial Areas Foundation  This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week, John McWhorter and I are joined by Greg Thomas, senior fellow at the Institute for Cultural Evolution and CEO of the Jazz Leadership Project, to discuss one of our perennial Big Questions: Are we ready to deracialize? As you may have gathered from his previous TGS appearance, that’s the kind of issue Greg loves to sink his teeth into. But I do have some questions of my own for Greg. Let’s get into it.We begin with a little jazz talk. I ask Greg how he goes about incorporating the principles of the music into the workshops he leads with the Jazz Leadership Project. He goes on to explain how the history of jazz provides a way of understanding how we can begin to envision a society that moves past race. Greg uses the work of Albert Murray and Ralph Ellison as examples, but I want to know why I and other black people should have to abandon our racial self-identification? Surely this task can’t fall to black people alone. I suggest to Greg that he’s unjustifiably conflating black identity and the victim mentality—you can have the former without the latter. After a brief discussion about whiteness and deracialization, Greg departs, leaving John and me to do a quick review of 2022 and to look ahead to 2023. This is a fiery one! It’s our final episode of the year. Thank you all for watching, listening, and reading. John and I will be back in 2023. See you there!Featured Content from the Manhattan InstituteDaniel Di Martino released a report with reforms to America’s immigration system, which is turning off high-skilled immigrants due to slow processing and unneeded bureaucracy.  0:00 The principles of jazz 7:14 “Deracialization Now” 13:00 Becoming Omni-American 20:46 What’s wrong with racial identification? 25:36 Black victimization and cultural memory 35:15 The transformations of James Baldwin 42:10 Convincing white people to deracialize 48:40 Takeaways from 2022 55:33 2023’s big Supreme Court decisionsLinks and ReadingsJazz Leadership ProjectInstitute for Cultural Evolution BME CommunityGreg’s essay, “Deracialization Now” Albert Murray’s book, The Omni-Americans: Some Alternatives to the Folklore of White Supremacy John’s book, Talking Back, Talking Black: Truths about America’s Lingua FrancaKwame Anthony Appiah’s book, Cosmopolitanism: Ethics in a World of Strangers Reconstruction.us Abigail Thernstrom’s book, Whose Votes Count?: Affirmative Action and Minority Voting Rights  This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Why Glenn does The Glenn Show13:02 Glenn: “If I was going to vote for Trump, I wouldn’t tell you”19:21 “The cat is out of the bag” on election denial25:45 Modeling epistemic modesty31:12 Why is race such an important issue for Glenn?39:13 The Old Glenn and the New Glenn45:46 Confronting the past50:44 Putting “the funk” on the story of your lifeRecorded October 27, 2022Links and ReadingsHamish’s podcast, The Active VoiceEmily Oster’s SubstackRobert Wright’s Nonzero NewsletterNonzero’s YouTube channelMatt Taibbi’s SubstackMatt Taibbi’s book, Hate, Inc.: Why Today’s Media Makes Us Despise One AnotherBraver AngelsJohn McWhorter’s book, Woke Racism: How a New Religion Has Betrayed Black AmericaBenjamin Crump’s book, Open Season: Legalized Genocide of Colored PeopleGlenn’s Quillette piece, “Unspeakable Truths about Racial Inequality in America”Glenn’s first Bloggingheads appearance, with Joshua Cohen in August 2007James Q. Wilson’s book, Thinking about CrimeRafael Mangual’s recent TGS appearanceAndrew Sullivan’s SubstackAlex Berenson’s Substack This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Why are we paying so much attention to Kanye West’s antisemitism?14:02 The two words you never say together23:28 Could widespread antisemitism take hold in the US?36:53 The mythological black past and the realities of the present48:12 How necessary is rootedness to the modern human experience?56:54 How we make race, how race makes usRecorded on December 10, 2022Links and ReadingsDave Chappelle’s SNL monologue on Kanye West and Kyrie IrvingJohn’s NYT piece, “It’s Too Darn Loud”  Wilson Jeremiah Moses’s book, Afrotopia: The Roots of African American Popular HistoryOrlando Patterson’s essay, “Toward a Future That Has No Past – Reflections on the Fate of Blacks in America”Rogers Brubaker’s book, Ethnicity without GroupsGlenn and John’s May 2020 conversation about George Floyd This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week we’ve got something special for you here at The Glenn Show. In late October, I convened in person in New York City with the economist Richard Wolff for an extended debate on the comparative merits of capitalism and socialism. Some of you may have seen Rick’s previous appearance on TGS, where he joined John McWhorter and me for a similar debate. Rick and I both felt that we had more to say than that format allowed, so we agreed to meet face to face. Both of us are passionate defenders of our positions—capitalism for me and socialism for Rick—so we knew we needed a moderator to keep things on track. Luckily, I knew just the person: my lovely wife, LaJuan Loury. If you’re a regular viewer, you’ll know that LaJuan and I have some stark political differences; her views have more in common with Rick’s than with mine. (And if you’re a regular podcast listener, you’ll recognize her voice from the introduction to every episode.) Rick and I agreed that LaJuan would set the agenda, formulate the questions that we would debate, and moderate the conversation. I think you’ll agree that she more than rose to the challenge. As you might expect, this is a lively exchange. Rick and I have real differences in the ways we think about economics and politics. One thing on which we do agree is the necessity of having serious debates like this one in a civil and open manner. As TGS continues to grow, you can look forward to more content like this. You can also look forward, if all goes according to plan, to more LaJuan. And if you find yourself wishing for even more pushback on Rick’s positions than I offered, stay tuned. This Sunday’s edition of the newsletter will feature a bonus episode with the economist Gene Epstein, who offers a forceful rebuttal to Rick’s previous appearance on the show. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Featured Content from the Manhattan Institute“Prejudice must be measured rigorously. Statistically. Disparity doesn’t necessarily imply racism. It may feel omnipresent, but it isn’t all-powerful. Skills matter most,” writes Roland Fryer.  0:00 Is capitalism a “winner take all” system? 12:54 Why does the word “socialism” make so many Americans afraid? 24:55 Has neoliberalism been beneficial for the US? 33:25 Capitalism’s role in rising living standards around the world 40:59 Are higher interest rates the only solution to inflation? 52:36 Can the market eradicate employment discrimination? 1:02:12 Why is the rent too damn high? 1:13;20 Can there be a kinder, gentler form of capitalism? 1:18:58 Closing statementsRecorded October 26, 2022Links and Readings Rick’s previous appearance on The Glenn ShowGary Becker’s book, The Economics of Discrimination Matthew Desmond’s book, Evicted: Poverty and Profit in the American City This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 How the pandemic affected diversity in the theater10:24 James gets drawn into an “antiracist” meltdown during rehearsal21:08 James’s story of ostracism and Loving v. Virginia26:58 Juilliard students revolt39:19 A plea for mutual understanding in the theater47:57 A preview of things to come on The Glenn Show50:32 Glenn’s problem with “racial inequity”59:18 Getting through to “Donna”1:03:58 To speak your mind or to speak strategically?Recorded November 27, 2022Links and ReadingsJames’s homepageGlenn and John’s conversation with Don BatonJohn’s NYT piece, “‘Racism’ Without Racists”Ronald Ferguson’s speech from Glenn’s festschrift This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 What does “black identity” mean?4:53 Why Bob left the Civil Rights Movement8:04 Shelby: Our problem today is freedom, not racism15:36 Glenn: We can’t afford to give up on black collective goals21:30 Why Shelby wouldn’t sign a letter of support for Clarence Thomas30:13 Would freeing ourselves from race mean sacrificing collective action?39:10 The tactical efficacy of racial identification44:32 The struggle for human freedom50:46 Can we take pride in group achievements past?1:02:22 Kmele: We have a too-narrow sense of diversity1:07:20 Glenn: “The future is assimilation”1:13:03 Concluding statementsLinks and ReadingsKmele’s podcast, The Fifth ColumnThe Woodson CenterGlenn and Bob’s letter of support for Clarence ThomasThomas Chatterton Williams’s book, Self-Portrait in Black and White: Family, Fatherhood, and Rethinking Race This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Glenn’s culinary dilemma3:31 Why the Republican Party depresses John8:14 What’s the difference between Herschel Walker and John Fetterman?13:12 Glenn’s argument for voting Republican30:01 Woke theater’s “melodramatic agitprop”43:10 Kanye, Kyrie, and the Jews54:00 What’s “systemic,” “structural,” or “institutional” about racism?Recorded on November 13, 2022Links and ReadingsJohn’s NYT column, “Racism and Theater, Then and Now”Glenn and John’s conversation with orchestra conductor Don BatonWilson Jeremiah Moses’s book, Afrotopia: The Roots of African American Popular History This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

My guest this week, filmmaker Rob Montz, is an unlikely figure: a libertarian-leaning Brown University graduate who loves ‘90s rap and produces politically inflected documentaries that push back against the orthodoxies of the mainstream media. Rob has featured me in several of his works, and so I thought it was time to return the favor and have him on TGS.I begin by asking Rob how someone with a Brown pedigree ends up interested in such un-Brown-like figures as Charles Murray, Roy Beck, and Scott Atlas. Rob traces out his path from Brown to the Cato Institute to starting his own company, Good Kid Productions. He talks about some of his work, including a forthcoming doc about James Blake and Kyle Rittenhouse and one defending Roland Fryer from Harvard’s spurious sexual harassment charges. We then discuss the niches we’ve created for ourselves outside of the mainstream. Rob asks whether there’s a place for younger figures who can follow in my footsteps by achieving legitimacy both within academia and as a critic of the pieties that govern academic and political life in the US. We then move on to what’s shaping up to be one of the most crucial questions of the next two years: Trump or DeSantis? And finally, I ask Rob about his abiding affection for rap.Rob is doing important work as a filmmaker, and I recommend that everyone check out his YouTube channel. I’ll certainly be keeping an eye on it to see what comes next. (Note: This conversation took place on September 20, 2022, before the latest set of controversies around Kanye West emerged.)This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Featured Content from City JournalRoland G. Fryer discusses affirmative action, why the current system doesn’t work, and suggests alternatives to the status quo.0:00 The appeals of immigration restrictionism 16:52 The 2013 Ray Kelly incident at Brown University 24:39 Rob’s forthcoming documentary about Jacob Blake and Kyle Rittenhouse 36:29 The response to Rob’s Roland Fryer doc 41:41 Why Rob and Glenn aren’t seeking the mainstream spotlight 47:20 Is there a “next Glenn Loury”? 55:10 Glenn’s course on race and policing be required? 1:02:19 Rob’s position on Trump 1:09:11 DeSantis vs. Trump 1:15:22 Rob’s love of ‘90s rapLinks and ReadingsGood Kid Productions on YouTubeRob’s interview with Roy BeckRay Kelly getting heckled at Brown in 2013Rob’s interview with Jay BhattacharyaRob’s mini-doc about Roland FryerRoland Fryer’s education company, ReconstructionRoland Fryer’s other company, Equal Opportunity Ventures Dexter Filkins’s New Yorker piece on Ron DeSantis This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

I’m back with John McWhorter for the latest installment of our ongoing conversation. John hit some technical snags in the first ten minutes of the recording, so apologies if the beginning sounds a little jumpy. After that, things smooth out. On to the conversation.We begin by talking about my memoir, which is now, after years of false starts, humming along nicely. But the process has forced me to confront some very dark episodes from my past, and they don’t always cast me in the most flattering light. As I explain, I think that presenting this unvarnished account of my own actions is necessary, both in the service of truth and in building credibility. John says he’ll probably never write a memoir, but I believe that if he sat down to do it, people would be more receptive than he thinks they would. After a rant about the “lightweights” against whom John and I often find ourselves pitted in the public square, we consider that we and people like us are finally making some headway in the conversation about race. Our views are no longer so marginal, and we may even be in, as John says, a “golden age of black heterodoxy.” And speaking of heterodoxy, I recount my recent debate with Shelby Steele, Robert Woodson, and Kmele Foster on “the ethics of racial identity” (watch this space for more soon). We finish the episode with accounts of the strange case of Jessica Krug’s racial masquerade and Darrell Brooks’s pathetic defense in his murder trial. We get deep in this one. As always, I’m looking forward to your comments. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Featured Content from the Manhattan InstituteReihan Salam argues Congress should fund innovative public–private partnerships now to prepare for a future pandemic. 0:00 Walking through the valley of the shadow of death 5:20 Earning credibility through self-discrediting disclosure 16:29 The lionization of the lightweights  21:09 The golden age of black heterodoxy 26:01 The mainstreaming of Glenn and John 37:36 Glenn’s debate with Shelby Steele, Robert Woodson, and Kmele Foster 45:45 Are we ready to “get past race”? 56:03 The strange case of Jessica Krug 1:03:46 Darrell Brooks’s courtroom performanceLinks and ReadingsThe announcement for 2022 Philip Merrill Award for Outstanding Contributions to Liberal Arts EducationKmele Foster’s podcast, The Fifth Column Darrell Brooks’ closing statement at his trial This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

As I mentioned at the start of our latest subscriber-only Q&A episode, John McWhorter recently received the 2022 Philip Merrill Award for Outstanding Contributions to Liberal Arts Education, bestowed by the American Council of Trustees and Alumni. According to the ACTA, the award honors “individuals who have made an extraordinary contribution to liberal arts education, core curricula, and the teaching of Western Civilization and American history.” Perhaps I’m biased, but I can think of no one who more richly deserves such recognition, and so I was proud to be asked to deliver some remarks in tribute to John at a ceremony, which I offer below. (I’ve also recorded an audio and video version for those who prefer to listen and watch. The audio is available now, video will uploaded tomorrow.)Next month will mark the fifteenth anniversary of my first recorded dialogue with John. Since that first episode, the two of us have experienced much. The beginnings and ends of marriages, the loss of loved ones, the birth of children and grandchildren, not to mention changes in political orientation and new career paths. Through all of that, John and I have kept talking to each other. I think those conversations are important for the reasons I state below. But equally important to me is the friendship that has allowed us, despite our differences, to keep the dialogue going. Without that bond, we may have been able to continue the conversation, but it would not have meant nearly as much to me as it does. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.There are things that don’t—or can’t—get said when we talk about race in most venues in America. Those who have followed the 15-year-long conversation on this topic that I have been undertaking with John at The Glenn Show know what I’m talking about, whether it’s crime in black communities or out-of-wedlock birthrates, academic underperformance or the unbearable intellectual lightness of anti-racism agitation. In academia, in mainstream publications and media outlets, and increasingly in K-12 classrooms, what I’ve called “the bias narrative” holds sway. Negative aspects of black life are attributed almost entirely to the nation’s history of racial oppression, which is said to begin in the early seventeenth century and to continue unabated to this day. We are said to be a bandit society built on genocidal plundering undertaken by unrepentant racists.That’s one story you could tell. And if that story were just one of many circulating through our national discourse, it wouldn’t be the worst thing. But this “bias narrative” has become not just one of many stories. It’s now the only story on newspaper opinion pages, in scholarly journals, and in educational materials disseminated throughout our schools. It’s the story told by the White House. It’s the story that ramifies out from the most elite precincts of our country and shapes ordinary conversations and relations between individuals. Its grip on so many areas of the public imagination has become so tight that anyone challenging it is viewed with suspicion and, often enough, outright contempt. If an alternate explanation for black underperformance is proffered, it’s not the explanation that gets challenged but the individual making it. For to challenge this narrative, ipso facto, proves that one is a racist, or a deplorable or, if the challenger is a black man, an Uncle Tom.This situation is intellectually infantile and morally bankrupt. How we talk and think about race has consequences that can be measured not just in dollars and cents but in stagnant lives and dead bodies. So, responding with ad hominem attacks to any account of our current predicament that is not rooted in bias isn’t merely unfortunate, it is actively damaging. The stakes are enormously high here and the hour is late. Candor, integrity and courage are in short supply. Name-calling and character assassination have largely replaced open debate, while naked emperors, pseudo-academics, and bombastic demagogues command the public square.Enter John and Glenn. Or as I sometimes like to refer to our duo, enter the WokeBusters!!In Hans Christian Anderson’s story “The Emperor's New Clothes,” two swindlers promise to provide an emperor with magnificent new clothes that will be invisible to those who are too stupid or incompetent to see them. Officials see plainly see that no clothes are being produced on the swindler’s looms, but none of them will say anything to avoid being thought of as a fool. So when the emperor walks through the city in his new “clothes,” everyone can see that he is naked, but no one will be the first to say it. But then comes along an innocent child who, in his naïveté, is willing to defy this false consensus and speak out.The thing about the child in that story is not that he’s saying it. It’s not even that other people hear him say it. It’s that everybody knows that everybody else has heard him say it. The child has created a situation in which it becomes common, shared knowledge that the emperor has no clothes. Everyone now knows that everyone knows the truth.German political scientist Elisabeth Noelle-Neumann coined a term that describes this phenomenon: the “Spiral of Silence.” In a spiral of silence, when holding a certain view entails a stigma then people stay silent for fear of being seen as having that view. Thus the masses believe they are alone or in a small minority of people with the stigmatized view, when in fact they are indeed one of the masses.In progressive-controlled areas of our society today, we are suffering from a spiral of silence when it comes to the topic of racial justice. A great many Americans don’t like it when Colin Kaepernick takes a knee at a football game and says, “I’m not going to stand for this national anthem,” or when a Black Lives Matter activist rises with his balled fist and says, “Burn this city down.” But they are afraid to be the only one in their community saying it, to be perceived either as racist or as a supporter of racism, for holding mild views that, arguably, most of America holds, views such as the obvious fact that “White lives matter, too!”There is a deeper point here. Though overt censorship is often spoken of as the leading threat to open discourse, the more subtle threat arises from the voluntary limitation of one’s own speech that create a spiral of silence. As John Stuart Mill recognized in his masterwork On Liberty, it is not the iron fist of state repression but rather the velvet glove of society’s seduction that constitutes the real problem.Who, we must ask, will speak for compromise and common sense, when to speak in this way is seen to signal a weak commitment to “the struggle”? Who will insist that we speak plainly and tell the truth about delicate and difficult matters (such as, the despicable black-on-black violence now ravaging many of our cities), matters that we would all prefer to cover-up or ignore? Who will declare “the emperor” to be naked? How can a nation sustain an elevated political discourse, when the social forces of conformity which promote silence threaten to usher in a dark age? In truth, it cannot. But, with a simple choice, with just a little bit of bravery, you and I can choose to be like that child who spoke truth to the empire. We can put an end to the gaslighting, the lying, and the willful blindness to reality on issues of race and social justice that are so characteristic of our time.My friend and longtime conversation partner, Professor John Hamilton McWhorter, IV, with his books, opinion pieces, and via his public ministry at The Glenn Show has, for nearly a quarter-century, been pointing the way. It is now up to those of us who are committed to an honest engagement with this age-old American dilemma of race and social justice to follow his lead, if only we dare do!Thank you. This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 How Rafael came to the Manhattan Institute7:33 Rafael’s new book, Criminal (In)Justice: What the Push for Decarceration and Depolicing Gets Wrong and Who It Hurts Most15:35 Is prison the right response to violent crime?26:20 Why Rafael believes in three-strikes-type sentencing guidelines31:42 Incarceration may lower crime, but is it just? 41:54 Rafael: Defunding the police is an indefensible idea49:34 Should we worry about racial disparities in the non-deadly use of force by police?1:00:08 Why Rafael’s father didn’t want him to become a copLinks and ReadingsRafael’s new book, Criminal (In)Justice: What the Push for Decarceration and Depolicing Gets Wrong and Who It Hurts MostRafael’s conversation with former NYPD and LAPD police commissioner William BrattonRoland Fryer and Rafael’s appearance on Peter Robinson’s Uncommon Knowledge podcast This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Is racist heckling at sporting events a real problem?15:13 John: “If you can’t be made fun of, you’re not part of the group”26:42 The LA County Federation of Labor racism scandal34:10 Why is there no Latino Michael Brown?41:22 Exalting (and exaggerating) the victim role47:47 Glenn’s daughter’s upcoming appearance on The Glenn Show49:48 Elite discrimination against AsiansLinks and ReadingsJohn’s NYT piece, “What a Report of Extreme Racism Teaches Us”Wilfred Reilly’s book, Hate Crime Hoax: How the Left Is Selling a Fake Race WarJohn’s NYT piece, “Stop Making Asian Americans Pay the Price for Campus Diversity” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Matt’s profile of the artist Rahmaan Statik11:26 Chicago’s “Great Unraveling” 20:41 Is Chicago slouching toward dystopia? 29:50 How will the near-end of cash bail affect crime in Chicago?33:24 The responsibilities of teachers, parents, and the police46:59 A snapshot of crime in Chicago52:26 Matt runs the numbers on Illinois’s out-of-wedlock births1:02:44 Lori Lightfoot’s prospects for reelectionLinks and ReadingsMatt’s book, What Next, Chicago?: Notes of a Pissed-Off Native SonWirepointsMatt’s profile with artist Rahmaan BarnesRahmaan Barnes’s artUniversity of Chicago Crime Lab’s Becoming a Man program This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 Is Florence Price’s music worthy of its current popularity?12:20 The decline of blind auditions18:27 Do diverse orchestras attract diverse audiences and musicians?23:26 Why Don is protecting his real identity27:00 Glenn delivers a soliloquy on humanity32:06 John: Eliminating blind auditions is “bat s**t crazy”38:22 Should John’s daughters benefit from affirmative action?Links and ReadingsDon’s Substack, The PodiumDon’s series on Florence Price: Part One, Part Two, Part ThreeFlorence Price’s Symphony No. 3Van Cliburn’s performance of Rachmaninoff’s Piano Concerto No. 2Anthony Tommasini’s NYT piece, “To Make Orchestras More Diverse, End Blind Auditions”George Walker on YouTubeWilliam Dawson’s Negro Folk SymphonyWilliam Grant Still’s Symphony No. 1Claudia Goldin and Cecilia Rouse’s article “Orchestrating Impartiality: The Impact of ‘Blind’ Auditions on Female Musicians”John’s NYT piece, “Stop Making Asian Americans Pay the Price for Campus Diversity” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week I welcome Lara Bazelon back to the show. Lara is a lawyer, a professor of law, and the author of several books, including the excellent novel A Good Mother. Lara is also an energetic free speech advocate who has taken some principled stands that have, at times, put her at odds with other progressives.We begin by discussing Lara’s decision to represent a college student, “John,” who had been found culpable for the alleged rape of a fellow student. Lara explains how the Title IX regulations under which John was investigated unfairly stacked the deck against him. These regulations, while providing needed protections for women, can also allow for unfair results that can potentially destroy the lives of the accused without giving them a chance to defend themselves. As a feminist, Lara is committed to defending women’s equality, but she is also uncomfortable with the ways that some progressives seem willing to sacrifice free speech in the name of equity. This has led her to work with pro-free speech organizations that have, among other things, defended Amy Wax against Penn Law’s attempt to fire her. Lara finds many of Amy’s statements odious, but she does not believe Amy should be silenced. She’s even found common cause with conservatives with whom she has worked to overturn wrongful convictions.Lara is proof that, even in our current political environment, principled conservatives and progressives can act together in good faith to achieve some common goals. I admire her courage and conviction, and I’m very curious to know what all of you think.This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Featured Content from City JournalJoanna Williams discusses how the concept of a motherhood pay “penalty” indicates a society with misplaced priorities. 0:00 Lara’s critique of Title IX adjudications 9:29 Why Lara defended a college student accused of rape 19:17 Lara’s cross-examination of the accuser 26:45 The trouble with “Believe Women” 36:11 What the Trump Administration got right about Title IX 39:26 Why Lara supports Amy Wax’s freedom of speech 50:25 Does Glenn still feel marginalized? 56:58 Finding common ground amidst political tribalism 1:01:12 Lara’s work on racial disparities in sexual assault casesLinks and ReadingsLara’s new book, Ambitious Like a Mother: Why Prioritizing Your Career Is Good for Your KidsLara’s book, Rectify: The Power of Restorative Justice After Wrongful ConvictionLara’s novel, A Good MotherLara’s keynote address at FIRE’s 2022 Student Network ConferenceUniversity of San Francisco’s Juvenile & Criminal Justice Law ClinicPenn Law Dean Theodore Ruger’s letter to the Faculty Senate regarding Amy WaxThe Academic Freedom Alliance’s letter in support of Amy Wax This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week, John McWhorter and I welcome special guest Ian Rowe to TGS. Ian is a senior fellow at the American Enterprise Institute, the founder and CEO of Vertex Enterprise Academies, and author of the new book Agency: The Four Point Plan (F.R.E.E.) for ALL Children to Overcome the Victimhood Narrative and Discover Their Pathway to Power. Ian is doing outstanding work establishing charter schools throughout New York City, so John and I invited him on to discuss his efforts, among other topics. We begin by discussing how the Rodney King beating and the LA riots that followed the acquittal of the officers involved led Ian and Nique Fajors to make a documentary, which, decades later, developed into their podcast Invisible Men. Ian thinks that two related and competing narratives—“blame the system” and “blame the victim”—place pressure on black teens and young men, and his work at the Vertex Enterprise Academies’ charter schools tries to help them grow in another direction. Ian stresses marriage as a central component in long-term success, but I push him to explain how marriage can correct for dysfunctional patterns present in husband and wife that have been present since childhood. John introduces the issue of academic success and “acting white”—can Ian’s schools overcome cultural barriers to black academic excellence? Ian then talks more generally about the ins and outs of running a group of charter schools in New York and their recent legal victory over a teacher’s union that tried to block their funding. And finally, we talk about the recent Old Parkland Conference, which Ian and I had a hand in organizing. He’s got some exciting things planned for the next phase in that project.Ian is out there on the front lines of education reform. It’s heartening to see someone with his intelligence and drive fighting the good fight. I’m very much looking forward to your comments on this one. Featured Content from City JournalJason Riley discusses the upcoming midterm elections, analyzing the impact of this summer’s SCOTUS decision on Roe and the prospects for the GOP to retake power in DC. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 How Rodney King led to Ian’s podcast, Invisible Men 7:31 Blaming the system and blaming the victim 13:20 Ian: I run schools to show my students they can do hard things 17:16 What’s so special about marriage? 29:24 Glenn: Right living is its own reward 41:34 The problem of success and “blackness” 40:26 Ian’s experience running Vertex 45:41 How Ian funds his schools 55:46 The bureaucratic opposition to charter schools 58:47 What comes after the Old Parkland Conference?Links and ReadingsIan’s book, Agency: The Four Point Plan (F.R.E.E.) for ALL Children to Overcome the Victimhood Narrative and Discover Their Pathway to PowerIan’s charter school group, Vertex Partnership AcademiesIan and Nique Fajors’s podcast, The Invisible MenIan and Naomi Schaefer Riley’s podcast, Are You Kidding Me?Milton Friedman and Thomas Sowell speak at the 1980 Fairmont Conference Video from the Old Parkland Conference Glenn, Ian, and Robert Woodson’s appearance on Peter Robinson’s Uncommon Knowledge This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Source post0:00 Introducing Glenn Loury8:50 What is “social capital”?19:24 Racial inequality and self-segregation 30:01 Glenn: “The jig is up” on affirmative action39:45 Balancing preferences and colorblindness 45:35 Rethinking the welfare state55:41 Why Glenn’s forthcoming memoir is titled The Enemy Within  This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

0:00 What’s on the menu for Glenn’s birthday party 4:49 John’s Twitter spat with Ibram X. Kendi 14:05 What do we lose by changing testing standards? 20:39 Glenn: If groups matter, then culture matters 32:04 How to prove a racist wrong 39:19 The ballad of Glenn and Woody 51:50 Mitchell S. Jackson’s Esquire essay about Clarence ThomasLinks and Readings John and Ibram X. Kendi on Twitter, part oneJohn and Ibram X. Kendi on Twitter, part two John’s NYT piece, “Lower Black and Latino Pass Rates Don’t Make a Test Racist” John’s NYT piece, “Proving Racists Wrong Is Not a Trivial Pursuit”Glenn’s 1992 Commentary essay, “Free at Last?”This American Life segment on Glenn and WoodyMitchell S. Jackson’s Esquire essay, “Looking for Clarence Thomas”Barry Bearak’s 1997 NYT profile of Ward Connerly This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Normally this week I would post a conversation with John McWhorter. However, due to unforeseen circumstances, we were unable to record. He’ll be back next week. This week, I’m presenting my conversation with Steve McIntosh, President, Co-Founder, and Director of the Institute for Cultural Evolution. I’ve already spoken with two ICE fellows this year—Stephanie Lepp and Greg Thomas—so this TGS episode constitutes a continuation of the series. I ask Steve about his latest book, Developmental Politics: How America Can Grow into a Better Version of Itself, which he delivers as a primer on “cultural evolution.” He traces out a historical narrative that takes us from traditionalism to modernity to our present moment of “progressive postmodernity,” and I ask him whether the more excessive elements of our era should be fought or viewed as a stepping stone to the next phase of cultural development. Steve’s answer: “both.” He discusses his account of the last 300 years mostly in terms of Europe and North America, so I ask him how the rise of East Asia fits into the evolutionary processes he discusses. The recent attack on Salman Rushdie leads me to wonder how a cultural evolutionist framework can help us deal with radically anti-modern movements like violent Islamic fundamentalism, and Steve advocates for the promotion of moderate forms of Islam that are in-step with the rest of the world. Steve includes worrying identitarian movements like Black Lives Matter and Kendiesque anti-racism within the progressive postmodern paradigm, but he also thinks that many good things—like gay rights—have come out of it. We close our conversation by considering what a cultural evolutionist has to say about the increasingly dire political polarization we’re experiencing in the US and development within African American communities. I don’t know that I’m wholly convinced by the grand historical narrative Steve offers, but we need as many new ideas as we can get in the discourse, and cultural evolution does have many virtues (like its praise of economic liberty). I look forward to reading your comments. Featured Content from City JournalStephen Eide discusses homelessness in New York City, the immigration related surge in shelters, and Mayor Adams sparring with Texas Governor Abbot. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 A scheduling announcement from Glenn 1:28 Steve's latest book, Developmental Politics: How America Can Grow into a Better Version of Itself 7:54 From modernity to progressive postmodernism 15:18 Are we in the midst of cultural evolution or culture war? 19:02 The work of the Institute for Cultural Evolution 30:52 “Modernist consciousness” in East Asia 37:07 Steve: “Force is necessary but not sufficient” to combat violent Islamic fundamentalism 44:01 The positive side of progressive postmodernism 49:15 Can cultural evolution overcome political polarization in the US? 55:38 A cultural evolutionary perspective on the African American development narrative Links and ReadingsInstitute for Cultural EvolutionSteve's latest book, Developmental Politics: How America Can Grow into a Better Version of Itself Steve’s book with John Mackey and Carter Phipps, Conscious Leadership: Elevating Humanity Through BusinessBari Weiss’s recent speech to University of Austin studentsGlenn and John McWhorter’s conversation with Richard WolffSteve’s white paper on political polarization in the wake of the Charlie Hebdo massacre This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week, one of the most controversial TGS guests of all time returns: Penn Law professor Amy Wax. She’s currently in a dire predicament. Her job is on the line. Whatever you think of Amy’s positions, there are issues at play in her case that have implications for people of all political persuasions, and she deserves to be heard out. Amy begins by recounting the events that have led up to her conflict with the administration at Penn Law and taking issue with the charges leveled at her by the school’s dean, Theodore Ruger. Some of those charges are quite serious: racism, sexism, and xenophobia. But Amy contends that they are overblown and implausible. Amy thinks this conflict began when she questioned the efficacy and ethics of affirmative action in public. If the LSATs and other standardized tests predict classroom performance, we shouldn’t be surprised when students admitted with low test scores don’t perform well. That’s a perfectly logical position, yet Amy has been pilloried for taking it. And I agree with her! But I tell her I do feel a little uncomfortable when I’m confronted by students who take my analysis of affirmative action personally. It’s clear that, even though Amy has tenure, her job is at risk Despite the very strong free speech protections guaranteed by tenure, she may be fired for speaking her mind in public. While I don’t agree with her on many issues, I think that would be a disaster. It could open the door to the evisceration of free inquiry within the American university. Amy has said and done many controversial things, including inviting the white nationalist Jared Taylor to speak with to her students. But Amy teaches a course on conservative political and legal thought, and Taylor is an influential figure in some far-right circles. I do press Amy on this, because she has espoused interest in the kind race realism associated with Taylor, and she argues that his ideas at least merit serious consideration.Amy and I are friends, but it wasn’t always so. I recall our first encounter, when she challenged some of my claims about race and mass incarceration. I wasn’t pleased at the time, but I’m now glad she had the freedom to make the comments she made (even though I still think I’m right). As she says, reality is often upsetting and uncomfortable, and if we choose to hide our heads in the sand rather than confronting reality, we can’t say we’re interested in the truth. That I do agree with. And I stand with her in fight to pursue the truth, even if we differ on where it may be found. If you want to support her, she provides some ways you can do that.The comments section is always explosive after Amy appears on TGS, so I’m looking forward to seeing what debates emerge. Let me know what you think!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Featured Content from City JournalCharles Fain Lehman & Renu Mukherjee on why support for the Democratic Party among high-skilled Asian-Americans is not immutable, which opens opportunities for Republican lawmakers to grow their voter base.0:00 Amy’s recent conflict with the Penn Law School administration  7:38 Amy responds to her dean’s charges of racism, sexism, and xenophobia  16:38 Should we take students’ feelings into account when discussing race and admissions?  27:34 Glenn: If Amy is fired, it will be an outrage beyond belief 34:53 Why Amy invited Jared Taylor to speak with her students 44:28 Amy’s defense of race realism’s legitimacy  50:25 Glenn and Amy’s first encounter  53:36 Amy: Sometimes reality is upsetting and offensive 58:58 How to help AmyLinks and ReadingsDean Theodor Ruger’s letter to the Penn Faculty Senate asking for a review of Amy’s conductAmy’s past conversations with Glenn Donate to Amy’s legal defense fund This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John McWhorter is back, reporting from his Catskills bungalow for the latest installment in our ongoing conversation. Let’s get into it. While I’m at home rather than a bungalow, I’m fresh off a wonderful vacation in North Carolina, which I spent surrounded by my wife, children, and grandchildren. Two of my granddaughters are now young women in college and law school, and they had some questions for me about some of the public positions I’ve taken. I recount the discussions I had with them about the Harvard-UNC affirmative action case and the Supreme Court’s abortion ruling. John recounts how calls for proportionate racial representation in the performing arts are leading not only to backstage disruptions but to the elevation of theatrical works that, in John’s view, lack quality but have the “right” political message.John thinks that intellectual insecurity sometimes plays a part in calls for “racial reckoning,” especially on campus. He notes that he never sees his most high-achieving and intellectually confident black students at Columbia involving themselves in campus activism of that kind, and I’ve had the same experience at Brown. All John’s stories about attempts to accommodate racial uprisings within the performing arts makes me wonder when someone is going to say “enough is enough.” Democratic politicians don’t seem willing to do it, but what about CEOs, heads of foundations, and other leaders in the private sector? It’s time for them to opt out of the DEI game.We end by returning again to the arts. John has written an excellent column arguing that, in most cases, we shouldn’t let the flawed personal views of artists stop us from enjoying their art. And we close with the disturbing case of Salman Rushdie, who is still in the hospital following last week’s attempt on his life.As always, I look forward to reading your comments.This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Featured Content from Manhattan Institute ScholarsOn this episode of the Hoover Institution’s Uncommon Knowledge, Peter Robinson talks with Manhattan Institute fellows Roland Fryer and Rafael Mangual about what is and is not working in policing and law enforcement in the U.S. 0:00 A report on the Loury family reunion 9:22 Identity politics onstage and backstage 19:22 Insecurity-driven campus grievance 27:01 Glenn: When will non-right-wing leaders say “Enough!” to racial grievance? 36:16 John: People with ugly opinions can also produce great art … 52:35 … but are there significant figures whose views disqualify them from public honor? 56:38 Considering fundamentalist Islam and human nature after the Salman Rushdie assaultLinks and Readings We See You, White American Theater’s “Principles for Building Anti-Racist Theatre Systems”New York City Center Encore!’s page for The LifeJames Baldwin’s 1949 essay, “Everybody’s Protest Novel”John’s NYT column, “Let’s Have Fewer Cancellations. Let People Take Their Lumps, Then Move On.”James Baldwin and William F. Buckley’s 1965 debate at Cambridge UniversityJames Baldwin’s 1962 essay, “Letter from a Region in My Mind” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

As I announced last week, we here at the newsletter and The Glenn Show have a new partner: the Manhattan Institute. I realize some of you may not be familiar with the Institute’s work and point of view, so today I’ve got Manhattan Institute President Reihan Salam on the show to talk about what the Institute does and how some of its scholars and fellows are thinking about the problems facing New York and other American cities today. The Manhattan Institute is often regarded as a conservative place, but as you’ll hear, there’s nothing predictable or partisan about how Reihan understands those problems and their potential solutions. Reihan begins by talking a bit about how he first became aware of me and my work. He’s a formidable thinker himself, so I have to say I’m pretty flattered! After discussing how he came to take on his current role at the Manhattan Institute, Reihan talks about some of the changes in crime rates in US cities necessitate a renewed focus on public safety. New York City Mayor Eric Adams, a Democrat, has shifted more resources to public safety-oriented initiatives. Reihan talks about what that shift might mean for the city. In many ways, Adams’s approach to governing doesn’t line up with Democratic national policy positions, and Reihan talks about how dissenters within political parties and movements (both left and right) can create needed change. Some of that change, Reihan argues, needs to come from more investment in certain government-run agencies, including those that comprise the criminal justice system. For example, he wants to see safer streets for ordinary citizens but also safer prisons for the incarcerated. The conversation moves on to education, and Reihan describes what he sees as the positive developments in New York schools under Michael Bloomberg, which languished under Bill de Blasio’s mayorship. And finally, we turn to race matters. Reihan is deeply skeptical that flattening out racial and ethnic identity under the banner of “BIPOC” actually helps ethnic minority communities, and he’s equally skeptical of the ways that racial identity has become central to how so many people think of themselves today. I agree, but I also wouldn’t want to discard the valuable histories and traditions that go along with our conception of race and identity. Maybe I want it both ways, but shouldn’t I be able to have that? If this conversation is any indication, TGS and MI have got a long, fruitful collaboration ahead of us. I’m looking forward to all the good work to come. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Featured Content from City JournalRenu Mukherjee on San Franscisco's misguided effort to do away with standardized testing for its most selective public high school—how it undermined merit and hurt many of the kids it intended to help. 0:00 Glenn’s impact on Reihan 5:38 How Reihan became president of the Manhattan Institute 11:15 What is the Manhattan Institute’s relationship to Eric Adams’s administration? 18:40 The value of dissenters 22:07 Reihan: We’ve underinvested in our criminal justice system 29:31 What constitutes a quality high school education? 36:38 Michael Bloomberg’s education initiatives 41:58 Reihan’s concerns about racial reification 50:08 The uses and abuses of racial identityLinks and ReadingsTariq Modood, Steven Teles, and Glenn’s book, Ethnicity, Social Mobility, and Public Policy: Comparing the US and UKRafael Mangual’s book, Criminal (In)Justice: What the Push for Decarceration and Depolicing Gets Wrong and Who It Hurts MostIsmail K. White and Chryl N. Laird’s book, Steadfast Democrats: How Social Forces Shape Black Political BehaviorMatt Feeney’s book, Little Platoons: A Defense of Family in a Competitive Age This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week on The Glenn Show, John McWhorter and I are joined by Richard Wolff, Professor Emeritus of Economics at the University of Massachusetts, Amherst and Visiting Professor of International Affairs at the the New School. Richard is Marxian in his orientation and I am not, so we do some debating here. And while we may not agree on much as far as economics goes, we do share some concerns about the direction of the left in this country. Before the conversation, I make an important announcement: Beginning today, I’m partnering with the Manhattan Institute to bring you The Glenn Show and this newsletter. I lay out what this means in my introduction and in conversation with John at the end of the show, but here are two important takeaways. First, I will maintain full editorial independence over all the content on the podcast and at the newsletter. And second, we’re lowering the cost of the newsletter. For monthly subscribers, fees will drop from $7/month to $6/month. The price of an annual subscription will drop even more substantially, from $70/year to $50/year. For those of you who already have an annual subscription, we’ll extend it by three months to make up the difference. I’m having success here at TGS, and I want to share it with you.And with that, let’s get into it. Richard begins by describing his student days and early career, when he was relatively quiet about his Marxism, the post-Occupy Wall Street environment that made him into a public intellectual, and his origins in Youngstown, Ohio, where the flight of capital devastated the formerly thriving industrial city. He argues that capitalism is not only bad for democracy but inherently anti-democratic, since it allows unelected CEOs and boards of directors to determine the economic fate of huge swathes of the populace. I take some issue with this. First, I ask Richard to respond to Friedrich von Hayek’s claim that markets will always allocate information and resources more efficiently than centrally planned economies. Second, I raise the point that business owners are entering into a contract with employees. It’s a standard exchange of goods and services. Why should employees have any right to the business owner’s property beyond an agreed-upon wage or salary? There is also the matter of socialism’s historical track record, which Richard defends. Richard and I do find some common ground in our skepticism toward the contemporary left, which sometimes seems to have abandoned the working class in favor of identity politics. Once Richard departs, John and I discuss my new partnership with the Manhattan Institute. He and I both want to make clear that John himself is not employed by the Manhattan Institute, though he used to be, and he still respects what they do. There’s a lot happening in this episode and in TGS World. As always, I look forward to reading your comments.This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 A special announcement from Glenn 3:47 Richard’s journey from quiet Marxist to public intellectual 9:08 Why Youngstown, Ohio was left behind  12:04 Richard: Capitalist ownership is inherently anti-democratic 15:41 Richard’s critique of Hayekian libertarianism    21:44 Pecuniary externalities vs. objective externalities  23:49 Socialism’s historical track record  31:07 Employees as stakeholders  34:36 The rise of the right in the wake of the New Deal and WWII 42:00 The Glenn Show’s new partnership with the Manhattan InstituteLinks and ReadingsThe Manhattan InstituteRichard’s book (with Stephen Resnick), Class Theory and History: Capitalism and Communism in the USSR Glenn and John on Herschel WalkerClifton Roscoe’s critique of Glenn and John on Herschel WalkerJohn’s NYT column about Walker This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week, we’re getting into cosmic terrain here on The Glenn Show with my guest and Brown University colleague, theoretical physicist Stephon Alexander.Steph takes his inspiration not just from other physicists but from artists and musicians as well. And I can report from personal experience that he is a tremendous jazz saxophonist. For him, there’s nothing superficial about the relationship between science and art. His first book, The Jazz of Physics, explores the connection between music and the elemental forces that hold our universe together. Steph’s project reminds me of one of my favorite books, Douglas Hofstadter’s Gödel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden Braid, which explores the role of self-reference in science, art, and music. Apparently I’m on the money, and Steph explains the central role of self-reference in his books. Steph and I both work in quantitative fields that demand measurable excellence of their participants, so I ask Steph what he thinks of racial and ethnic disparities in math-heavy areas of study. He describes his own experience as a teacher and as an undergrad, and how he learned that he would not only have to master the material but overcome lowered expectations that would only have held him back. Steph takes us through his latest book, Fear of a Black Universe: An Outsider’s Guide to the Future of Physics, which looks at the role of innovative “outsiders” (among whom Steph counts himself). Blacks may be “outsiders” in physics now, but the same was once true of Jews, and Steph talks about the inspiration he takes from the great Jewish physicists. This leads us to discuss some of my own ideas about stigma, and we have a good laugh about the times when stigma has led people to underestimate us. And finally, the question you’ve all been waiting for: What exactly is the Higgs boson, and why is its discovery such a big deal? I’ve learned a ton from talking to Steph, and I hope you will, too. I’m sure this isn’t the last time you’ll see him on TGS. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Glenn and Steph’s jam session 2:29 Steph’s adventures in the multiverse 6:40 The parallels between black art and physics 12:34 The centrality of self-reference in Steph’s work 18:26 Is there a racial dimension to how excellence reveals itself in students? 32:34 How Steph learned to level up 41:04 Steph’s new book, Fear of a Black Universe: An Outsider’s Guide to the Future of Physics 48:50 Steph’s admiration for prior generations of Jewish physicists 56:48 How Glenn and Steph navigate stigma 1:10:43 What is the Higgs boson?Links and ReadingsSteph’s first book, The Jazz of Physics: The Secret Link between Music and the Structure of the UniverseSteph’s latest book, Fear of a Black Universe: An Outsider’s Guide to the Future of PhysicsUltramagnetic MCs’ “Watch Me Now”Douglas Hofstadter’s book, Gödel, Escher, Bach: An Eternal Golden BraidGlenn’s book, The Anatomy of Racial Inequality This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John McWhorter is back again for one of our twice-monthly conversations. This is a hot one, so let’s get into it. In this week’s episode, we discuss three controversial figures: Herschel Walker, Clarence Thomas, and Amy Wax. We begin with John’s outstanding column about Walker, the Republican candidate for Senate in Georgia. John pulls no punches. He sees Walker as an insultingly underqualified contender meant solely to attract Georgia’s sizable black vote. John argues that Walker seems to have no meaningful knowledge of any relevant policy issue, and he’s apparently uninterested in trying to make it seem like he does. I do my best to present the case for Walker, but John does have a point. Robert Woodson and I wrote an open letter decrying recent ugly, racist (let me say again, racist) attacks on Justice Clarence Thomas, and John has signed on. I argue that, no matter what you think of Thomas’s conservatism, he is undeniably a towering figure in American jurisprudence. His influence and ideas will be felt for generations, and his life story as an African American born under Jim Crow who has risen to the pinnacle of the legal system is iconic. The attempt to write him out of black history just because he’s a conservative is disgraceful. It’s hard to find someone who has been the subject of more controversy than Thomas, but my friend Amy Wax has got to be in the running for second place. John is disturbed by reports that Amy allegedly brings some of her edgier ideas about race into the classroom when she teaches. I certainly don’t endorse all of Amy’s positions, and I think that one must be especially thoughtful when speaking in front of a classroom. But I can’t abide the idea that Amy would be punished simply for holding views that some people don’t like. That’s why I’m inviting her back to The Glenn Show.I’m sure everyone’s going to have a lot to say about this one. I can’t wait to read your comments, so fire away!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 John: Republicans’ elevation of Herschel Walker is an insult 9:43 If Walker is so inept, why does he have so much support?  15:16 Where’s the outrage over racist attacks on Clarence Thomas? 24:55 Thomas’s historical significance  36:03 The Clarence Thomas (and Al Sharpton) we don’t see 41:31 Are Amy Wax’s views beyond the pale?  53:59 John: “Amy should know better” 1:09:13 Amy Wax’s return to The Glenn Show Links and ReadingsJohn’s NYT column, “When Republicans Backed Herschel Walker, They Embraced a Double Standard”Glenn and Robert Woodson’s open letter on Clarence ThomasThurgood Marshall’s Bicentennial Speech Gerald Early’s Common Reader essay, “Black Conservatives Explain It All! or Princes and Powers 2.0”Glenn’s most recent conversation with Amy WaxAmy Wax’s book, Race, Wrongs, and Remedies: Group Justice in the 21st CenturyGlenn’s Daily Pennsylvanian column in support of Amy Wax This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

My guest this week is my friend Rajiv Sethi. Rajiv is Professor of Economics at Barnard College, Columbia University and External Professor at the Santa Fe Institute, and he writes an occasional newsletter at Imperfect Information. He’s published widely on problems of crime and segregation, among many other topics, and as you’ll hear in this conversation, he’s done some deep thinking about an area that is sadly pertinent to our society today: gun violence. I first ask Rajiv to catch me up on how economists are thinking about the state of financial markets today, and in short, things aren’t looking good. You don’t need a PhD in economics to know that. Just look at your stock portfolio. But Rajiv makes an interesting connection between the economist John Kenneth Galbraith’s analysis of the stock market crash of 1929 and the ongoing, much-publicized cryptocurrency crash. Rajiv talks about his blogging and his Substack, including his critique of Sundhil Mullainathan’s analysis of bias and police violence. We move on to the recent Supreme Court gun ruling and attempts by gun control advocates to float policies intended to reduce gun violence. Rajiv is critical of many of these policies, not because he doesn’t want to reduce gun violence but because he thinks the policies won’t be consequential enough. Much gun violence takes place amongst African Americans, but Rajiv wants to separate, to de-essentialize, race and violence. He draws on some of my own work on these issues to ask how we can look at the conditions that render acts of violence in high-crime areas, in some sense, rational. Certain conditions must make violence seem like the right solution to a given problem. Rajiv argues that we’re all—all Americans—involved in creating those conditions, and so we cannot simply say that the problems of high-crime black communities are their problems and not ours. I’m very much against racial essentialism, but we see it everywhere, including in our school with CRT-influenced policies and practices. While Rajiv acknowledges the excesses, he sees an equal threat coming from the anti-CRT backlash, and points to the case of Cecilia Lewis as an example. Along the same lines, he thinks that many critiques of the 1619 Project miss something important about the true depth and length of American history. And finally, we return to the problem of gun violence and bias in policing. Rajiv’s got an interesting idea to disincentivize illegal gun sales and some theories about why we see such stark racial disparities in the commission of gun crimes. Yesterday, I posted a conversation with John McWhorter that addressed civil and constructive disagreement. Rajiv and I certainly disagree about some things, but his arguments can’t simply be brushed aside. I’m quite interested to know what you all think of this one. Let me know!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 The cryptocurrency bezzle  6:52 Rajiv’s critique of the contact hypothesis 12:53 Will popular proposed gun control measures meaningfully reduce homicides?  19:08 Can we talk about culture without becoming essentialists? 30:19 Rajiv: I find self-censorship and anti-CRT mobs equally disturbing 43:28 Debating the 1619 Project 51:00 Rajiv’s idea to reduce illegal firearm sales: gun insurance  1:02:35 Why do we see such racial disparities in gun violence? Rajiv has some theories 1:11:02 What did we learn from the second Justice Department investigation in Ferguson? Links and ReadingsJohn Kenneth Galbraith’s book, The Great Crash 1929Rajiv’s Substack, Imperfect InformationRajiv’s post about The Anatomy of Racial InequalitySendhil Mullainathan’s NYT piece, “Police Killings of Blacks: Here Is What the Data Say” Rajiv’s post about Mullainathan’s claims Rajiv and Brendan O’Flaherty’s book, Shadows of Doubt: Stereotypes, Crime, and the Pursuit of JusticeRajiv’s conversation about guns with Bari Weiss and David French Glenn and Hanming Fang’s paper, “‘Dysfunctional Identities’ Can Be Rational” Glenn’s Cato Unbound essay, “A Nation of Jailers” and responses Nicole Carr’s ProPublica piece, “White Parents Rallied to Chase a Black Educator Out of Town. Then, They Followed Her to the Next One.” Ralph Ellison’s essay, “What America Would Be Like Without Blacks” Albert Murray, The Omni-Americans: Some Alternatives to the Folklore of White SupremacyJill Leovy’s book, Ghettoside: A True Story of Murder in AmericaGlenn’s conversation with Robert Woodson and Sylvia Bennett-Stone Voices of Black Mothers United This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Last month, John McWhorter and I participated in Heterodox Academy’s 2022 conference in Denver, Colorado. We spoke in front of an audience and discussed how to model constructive disagreement. But before that, we had a bit of a warm-up session with Zach Rausch, host of the Heterodox Out Loud podcast. Zach had us in to talk about our long relationship as conversation partners, civil discourse, and the purpose of the university. Newer listeners may be interested to hear about my “origin story” with John. While we’re good friends now, that wasn’t always the case. We’ve had our ups and downs, and we’ve switched sides on some issues. (Here’s our first recorded conversation, from November 2007.) But we keep coming back because we enjoy talking to each other too much to quit, and because we believe if we don’t have the kind of conversations we have, they might not happen at all. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.JOHN MCWHORTER: There's another thing actually, which is, you should distrust if you can look into yourself, a feeling that you're arguing for a point because doing so is what makes you a good person. You should strive to get away from the belly and stick with the head.GLENN LOURY: We come to the university as black or white or Latino or gay or trans. That's not who we are. Our essence is much broader and finer and deeper and richer and human than that. ZACH RAUSCH: Glenn Loury and John McWhorter on Heterodox Out Loud. I'm Zach Rausch. Today, a special conversation with both of them. This was recorded at Heterodox Academy's 2022 Conference in Denver. For those who could not be at the conference, we got your back. We recorded a few exclusive conversations with our featured speakers to give you a taste of the extraordinary conversations that were had. Our guests today are Glenn Loury, professor of the Social Sciences and Economics at Brown University, and John McWhorter, professor of Linguistics at Columbia University. John has authored over 20 books on issues of race and language and writes a widely read biweekly newsletter for the New York Times. Glenn has published numerous influential books on race, inequality, and economics. He's also the well-known host of the podcast The Glenn Show on BloggingheadsTV, where John is a regular guest. In our interview, we discuss the future of higher education and how we can improve our collective discourse. It was recorded on the morning of their talk at the conference. I asked Glenn what they'd be discussing. GLENN LOURY: I haven't got any idea. All I know is that the subject matter is how do you have productive conversations? I take it that John and I, in our podcast practice, model productive conversation. And so we're going to be reviewing the nuts and bolts and the foundation of how it is that we're able to discuss contentious matters with one another productively. In 2007, a guy called Josh Cohen, a philosopher at Stanford, invited me onto Robert Wright's platform Bloggingheads to discuss some lectures that I had given on mass incarceration at Stanford that year. That was my first exposure to any kind of podcasting. I came on. I had a couple of conversations with Josh. They were well received. Bob Wright invited me to be a regular contributor to his platform, hosting a variety of people of my choosing, and John was one of those people. This is 2007, at the height of the Democratic Party primary contest, which Barack Obama ultimately won. So John and I started having conversations prompted by the events of the day around questions of race. And my association with Bloggingheads developed such that I was doing a post once a week or so at Bloggingheads, and John would be a guest once a month or so on the platform that I was developing with Robert Wright at Bloggingheads. And that went on from 2007 continuously until the present day. We've expanded our reach, moved from the Bloggingheads platform to Patreon to Substack, and talk now every other week on a regularly scheduled basis, John and I, the black guys. JOHN MCWHORTER: Glenn and I were not exactly chummy for a lot of the aughts, and, not enemies, but we were not warm and fuzzy. And when we had our first conversation, it was amidst that context, and I think both of us knew it. And in terms of the fact that apparently Glenn and I have conversations that somebody might want to model their own after, which is something that I don't think either one of us ever thought about consciously, but that's what people seem to see, I think part of the way that probably we may have something to offer in that is that for our first session, it's not like it was two friends talking. We were coming from different places, and yet neither one of us were angry. It didn't get ugly. And so, for example, to take an instructive contrast—and this has nothing to do with settling scores—during that same era, I had a Bloggingheads exchange with Ta-Nehisi Coates, and this is before he was as famous as he would become. But Ta-Nehisi Coates and I have very different views on things, and the way it ended was a little bit unpleasant. And I would have to say that I was the person who initiated that, not him. But that was the way that you don't do it. You don't let the feelings get into the discussion. Glenn and I have never had that. There is an equipoise that many people could master where you could learn to converse about things that touch you in your gut. ZACH RAUSCH: And do you consider yourselves friends? JOHN and GLENN: Yeah. ZACH RAUSCH: Where do you think your strongest disagreements are between the both of you? JOHN MCWHORTER: Moralism, the morality of these issues. We seem to really hit a wall on that in that there's a part of you, Glenn, who is appalled at the way certain people behave, both rioters and, say, Nikole Hannah-Jones. Whereas there's a part of me that is annoyed but is always trying to think, are they capable of thinking out of their box? How angry can we be at them? We have an issue there. GLENN LOURY: Yeah. The way John once put it was, Omar makes me mad, but Omar makes him sad. Now, Omar is one of these characters that John has invented. This is part of his modus operandi. He creates these names for people, these types, these stereotypes or prototypes, and we kind of know who he's talking about. And Omar is a ruffian and ghetto bound, miscreant, messes up, commits crimes, doesn't take care of his kids, is standing on top of a car saying, “Burn this town,” and things of this kind. This is Omar. And I'm mad as hell at Omar. He pisses me off, and he makes John sad. And John wants to understand the Omar's of the world. JOHN MCWHORTER: I do, because I think Omar is a very parochial figure. I think Omar, just, it’s the only language he ever knew. I have a recoil in terms of Omar, if I was standing there watching him climbing up on the car. Omar is not my friend, but I look at him and I think, how could he know otherwise? And maybe in that I'm being too forgiving, maybe change doesn't happen when you think that way. Because what I'm doing is basically falling for the whole root causes bit, which has created so much harm. But I honestly think that a little bit of it is a way of avoiding the anger, which I'm afraid could also get in the way of constructive policy. I feel sorry for Omar, somehow. GLENN LOURY: He calls it moralism, and I would call it judgment. Yes, there is a certain right and wrong motivation to the anger that I have toward the bad acting ghetto dweller, but I'm going to argue that we need to set and give voice to standards of judgment about what is a right and wrong way of living. And I'm not afraid to say that this is the right way to live. Call it moralism, if you will. I'm not apologizing for that. JOHN MCWHORTER: You know, another thing, actually, that we ran up against, it's not as relevant now, but I was in love with Obama before he got in. I was really caught up in that romance. You refused to be. You were for Hillary. You thought she seemed like she would be the better president. In that you're probably right. But you weren't caught up in that idea of, “Oh, we're going to have the first black American president in the White House.” That was very logical of you. I could not summon logic to that extent. GLENN LOURY: It's generous of him to admit that I was right and he was wrong about something. I think that he was right and I was wrong about Donald Trump. Not that I was ever a Trump supporter, but I would say, man, lighten up on Trump. The people elected him president. If you don't like him, vote him out of office. The Trump derangement syndrome is unbecoming of you. Trump's an idiot. Trump whatever. I'm saying you're showing contempt for the 40 or 45% of your fellow countrymen who support Trump. Those are the people that you need to be having an argument, et cetera. So ultimately, when Trump tried to seize the presidency after having lost an election, I had to admit I was wrong about Trump. ZACH RAUSCH: Why do we need to have conversations between people who disagree with each other? Even if you don't change each other's minds? JOHN MCWHORTER: The soul of being an educated or enlightened person is to have come to realize that life and the world around us are complex if they don't lend themselves to easy answers. My mother once said, when I asked her when I was about ten, why do people go to college because even at that age I could tell unless they were techies they weren't coming out with any skill or they didn't seem to know the state capitals any better than anybody else. And I was saying, why are they in college? And she said, what you come out with in college is a sense that the answer to interesting things is not “Well, all I know is” and a snap of the fingers. And she's right about that. And what that means is that anything that's interesting is subject to different views about which there will be discussions where you learn about what the different views are. If you can't do that, you're not an enlightened person. And I think there's a tacit sense that you can be an enlightened person, but when it comes to race issues in particular, suddenly everything is very easy and no one else is to be listened to. No, it's the same with race, despite the injustice of black history. And so yeah, to be able to have a civil discussion even about polarizing issues is part of seeing further and having learned what the world is like. Many people who can't do that think that they are the enlightened ones and that they have a higher wisdom. But actually they are the blind man looking at the elephant. Their lens isn't wide enough. That's what I think. GLENN LOURY: Yeah, I think that's right. I think they're epistemic. How do you know something? Well, you know, by honing the precision and depth of your own argument, which is what you do in response to someone who has a different point of view. That's what the back and forth is about. You think this? I think that I think you're wrong. Here's why I think you're wrong. No, no, no, actually this is the reason that you're wrong. And that give and take and back and forth allows one to have a greater, deeper command of one's own position. But the other reason I think it's fundamentally important that we talk across the line is the health of our democratic order. We have to be able to deliberate about matters peacefully. The alternative to civil argument ultimately is violence. I don't think we want to go down that road. ZACH RAUSCH: Okay, let's switch to the academy. In higher ed, what are the conversations that are not happening and that you think need to happen more often? GLENN LOURY: Well, I would say the purpose of the university as an institution to foster research and search for truth and the development of the intellectual depth of the students and not a political platform for this or that enthusiasm where the university has to stand on the right side of history. So what is the university about ultimately? That's the way I would put it. JOHN MCWHORTER: Yeah. Or the tacit sense that the university is the university when it comes to physics or teaching French irregular verbs, but that when it comes to the tenants of early twenty-first century leftist social justice orthodoxy, there's only one thing to be taught and that there's no discussion to be had. The idea that the university is supposed to stand for that is extremely narrow and parochial. It won't look good in the future. And that needs to be questioned, although it's difficult because it's getting to the point where everybody who runs the show is steeped in that tacit sense of what it is to teach. But it isn't. And we need to go back to the original idea. ZACH RAUSCH: So how do we do it? How do we have better conversations? Where do we start on an individual level? GLENN LOURY: I’d offer a couple of things. One is, listen to your interlocutor. Listen. Don't be so much in a hurry to try to get your point across that you don't hear what's being said to you from the other side. That's a skill that one can develop. It requires patience and a certain amount of discipline. Listen. Actually, John taught me a lot about that, because he and I had a minor falling out over the fact that I interrupted him in the midst of it. I had developed this habit of cutting him off. And the reason I was cutting him off is because I was in such a hurry to say what I was thinking that I wasn't listening to what he was saying. So that's one thing. JOHN MCWHORTER: You know, there's another thing, actually, which is you should distrust, if you can look into yourself, a feeling that you're arguing for a point because doing so is what makes you a good person. You should strive to get away from the belly and stick with the head. You should be able to see that just saying, “Are you in favor of racism? Isn't that racism? How does that battle racism?,” that's so very vague, that sort of reasoning. It would also apply with sexism or any number of other isms. That will only make sense to you if what you're trying to do is validate your sense of being a good person as opposed to operating on the level of logic. The whole social justice argument is based on a notion that feelings are key and definitive when it comes to engaging in certain issues. And nobody said that that's true. And frankly, if you think about it, it isn't. There is never a justification for thinking you use logic except with a certain range of topics where suddenly feelings are logic. No, not even when you're talking about racism. And so that's something that people should avoid. Are you arguing in order to show God or the social justice gods that you're a good person? Or are you making a point? And I think most people are capable of understanding that if it's put that way to them. But it's very easy to go down a rabbit hole and forget. GLENN LOURY: Let me add something to that, because I think this is really important. Avoid ad hominem argument. It's about the issue not about the person. So the temptation, “Oh, you're the kind of person who thinks that,” to try to refute based upon a character assassination. You know, “How could you possibly think that?” That's no way to cultivate civil discourse. The other thing I would say is try to put the other guy's argument in your own words. Restate his argument. What did he actually say? JOHN MCWHORTER: Glenn is very good at that. GLENN LOURY: Not to believe it, but just to understand it. JOHN MCWHORTER: Which gives you a sense that a person can be a reasonable human being and have that view exactly. As opposed to demonizing other people, which is so easy to do, but it's primitive. And not to be repetitious, but I think there's a sense that when it comes to social justice issues, that primitive instinct is the proper one. You dehumanize the other side because there is evil in the world. But no, that makes no more sense there than it does when you're five years old and you think of the whole world that way. Life is not a Maurice Sendak book. And that's something that it's very easy to fall into when you're thinking more about what makes you a good person than what makes you a rational person. So, yeah, that demonizing has to go. ZACH RAUSCH: So before we go, I have one more question for you both. Our conference theme this year is, how do we restore trust in particularly higher education? What do you think about that? GLENN LOURY: Well, I understand this session this morning, the brunch session, is university presidents talking about leadership in the academy. And I think that's where the buck stops at the end of the day. I think it stops in the front office. I think that we are dependent on administrative leadership for making a stand. I mean, for embracing the Chicago principles, for example, about free inquiry and open discourse and whatnot. For insisting that the discussion of difficult and sensitive issues be balanced in the context of university, not one-sided. For avoiding the temptation to wave banners, which is often what I find university administrators doing, these letters expressing our values in the wake of whatever the particular crisis might be, if it's a George Floyd crisis or if it's a Ukraine crisis or if it's a COVID crisis. Giving voice to a particular way of looking at a difficult set of questions, which are arguable, but in effect, taking one side of that discussion and then putting the institution's weight behind the one side of that discussion. I think that's a practice that a university administrator should avoid. JOHN MCWHORTER: One of the things that I think people miss, from the outside. A lot of people think that it's not only administrators and professors who think this way, but there's this whiny, helicopter-parented student body, all of whom are right behind all of these excesses. Nothing could be further from the truth. On campuses, it's maybe one in 15 students who have the hyper-woke kind of politics ,if you're talking about undergraduates. Almost all of them can see through it. Some of them cower in fear of it. Some of them are brave enough to mock it, although it's getting harder to be that person these days. But this is not about the student body. And the student body are hungry for professors who can give them views from other places. And not the hyper-right wing, for better or for worse, but people who are standing outside. And if you're asking whether I mean partly myself, yes. I'm in a position to see that acgreat many students, and not ones from conservative white Utah families, are interested in hearing something different. And so it's not that the students are impervious to the truth. They see the problem among the faculty, too. That always gives me hope. I don't worry about the kids, I worry about the grownups. GLENN LOURY: Diversity, equity, and inclusion, okay? That's a plague, and we could have an argument about that. I think it's a disaster. I think the institutionalization of the diversity, equity, and inclusion imperatives threatened the integrity of the enterprise. I'm prepared to defend that position. Title IX. Way out of control in terms of due process and the way in which these kinds of incidents are handled by universities. The Roland Fryer case at Harvard. I give a case. We could give 100 cases. There's stuff that has to be fought over, I want to say. This is where Jon Haidt and I don't think see the world quite the same way. I don't want to just talk about process. Keep things open. Let's have diversity of viewpoints. I want to talk about some of the substantive judgments that I think are wrongheaded and need to be rebutted on their own terms. And I think the DEI stuff is a disaster. I think it lowers standards. I think it reifies identity, which we should be trying to rise above. We come to the university as black or white or Latino or gay or trans. That's not who we are. Our essence is much broader and finer and deeper and richer and human than that. The university sells its students short and betrays its own mission if it gets mired in this identitarian, small-minded, narrow way of looking at their charges, our students.ZACH RAUSCH: John McWhorter and Glenn Loury at Heterodox Academy's 2022 Conference in Denver. Keep your eyes peeled for full conference event footage on our YouTube channel at youtube.com/HeterodoxAcademy. Thanks to Davies Content for producing this podcast and to Kara Boyer on our communications team. I'm Zach Rausch. Until next time. This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

A couple weeks ago, The Glenn Show returned to New York’s Comedy Cellar. This time I was joined by John McWhorter and a trio of fantastic comics: Sherrod Small, Jon Laster, and Nimesh Patel. There were a lot of laughs and a lot big questions addressed, so let’s get into it.John and I begin with a comment left on one of our previous conversations from an economically disadvantaged white man who recounted his frustrated attempts to get into law school. Affirmative action helps elevate women and racial minorities, but shouldn’t it focus more on socioeconomic factors than “diversity”? John and I are always trying to move the needle on issues like this, and it’s sometimes hard to tell whether our conversations are having an effect. The crowd seems to think they are! John brings up charter schools, and I advance an argument in favor of more school choice. We then move onto racial disparities. I think that most people know on some level that “systemic racism” is not really the cause of racial disparities in the commission of violent crimes, and yet it’s so hard to have an honest conversation about it in casual circumstances. John argues that the real core of the race debate in America has to do with the relationship between black people and the police, at which point Sherrod, Nimesh, and Jon come out to join us. Laster tells us about the Jon Laster Challenge, in which he asked black men he knew to recount bad run-ins with the police and his app, which promotes black-owned businesses. Next, Sherrod shows off his crowd work chops and riffs with the audience. One audience member asks what draws the people who become police to the job, and I ask Jon what he really thinks we should do about violent crime in black communities. Finally, we end the event with some questions from the audience. I had a a lot of fun up there onstage, and I was so happy to meet the subscribers who came up to say hello afterward. If you missed us this time around, don’t worry. You’ll have another chance. Watch this space for more.Note: There were some slight technical difficulties with the recording. As a consequence, the first minute or so of the conversation is missing. Many apologies.This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Why do race and gender trump socioeconomics in affirmative action considerations?  9:03 Are Glenn and John making a difference in the race debate?  11:30 The argument for charter schools 19:54 Glenn: Nobody really believes that racism is the cause of racial disparities in crime 23:05 The difficulty of having an honest conversation about race and crime 28:15 Seizing the possibilities of our freedom  38:22 John: The race debate is about the cops 40:02 The Jon Laster Challenge 45:00 Sherrod talks to the crowd  47:27 Why do cops become cops?  54:41 Jon: Money is the biggest problem in black communities  1:03:16 Can poverty account for violence in black communities?  1:08:49 Q&A: Do we need more black police? 1:10:45 Q&A: Have Glenn and John gotten credit for highlighting The Trayvon Hoax? 1:16:59 Q&A: John clarifies his position on the Georgia voting law Links and Readings Ian Rowe’s book, Agency: The Four Point Plan (F.R.E.E.) for ALL Children to Overcome the Victimhood Narrative and Discover Their Pathway to PowerJon’s app, BlappSherrod’s podcast, Race Wars This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

As many of you know, Nikita Petrov, Creative Director of The Glenn Show and this newsletter, is Russian. He left his country after the invasion of Ukraine. Since then, the war and the role of Russian individuals in it have been weighing heavily on his mind, along with broader questions about responsibility and belonging. In this episode of The Glenn Show, Nikita and I discuss the problems of group affiliation and government action. When large-scale political and civil conflict fragments a society, how do we decide who “our people” are? And relatedly, how much responsibility do we bear for the actions of “our people” and our governments? This leads us to discuss racial and ethnic group belonging. I’m black, but how does that affect how I regard my relations with others of my race? One of “the people with three names” seems to think I’m not “authentically black” because I no longer live on the South Side of Chicago. But what does “authenticity” even mean in this case? From there we move into a broader historical register to consider the long and the unfinished work of emancipation, both that of African Americans and Russians (the serfs were freed in 1861). While, in my view, many blacks are still grappling with American democracy, Nikita notes that Russia experienced only a brief window of democracy between the Cold War and Putin’s rise. We conclude with a discussion of Russian and American wars, and the US’s role in amplifying executive power under Boris Yeltsin. Nikita is wrestling with some complicated questions, and I enjoyed talking them through with him. We’re both interested to hear your thoughts, so let us know in the comments.Want to keep the TGS talk going? We’ve had a Discord server for a while, but it was previously available only to paying Substack subscribers. Now we’re opening it up to everyone. So if you want to connect with other TGS fans to talk about the show or any topic related to it, click the button below to get in on the conversation. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Nikita asks: Who are “my people”? 14:09 How much responsibility do we bear for the actions of our governments? 21:53 The problem of racial affiliation  26:39 The use and abuse of group identity 35:00 Is Glenn “authentically black”? 40:39 The incomplete project of emancipation  50:28 Why was Russia’s period of true democracy so brief?  56:36 Democracy and “the Russian soul”  1:03:55 Can we compare antiwar Americans and antiwar Russians?  1:14:38 Glenn: Why would the US risk nuclear war with Russia over Ukraine?  1:20:09 The US’s involvement in drafting Russia’s constitution  Links and ReadingsNikita’s Substack, PsychopoliticaGlenn’s essay in City Journal, “The Case for Black Patriotism”Glenn’s speech at the National Conservatism Conference The Woodson CenterGlenn’s conversation with Sylvia Bennett-Stone and Robert WoodsonVoices of Black Mothers United This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John McWhorter is back again for the latest installment in our ongoing, nearly decade-and-a-half-long conversation. Let’s get into it. John starts out telling us about his current whereabouts: a Dirty Dancing-style bungalow in the Catskills. We move on to a developing story out of Princeton, New Jersey, where a group of parents has written an open letter protesting the school district’s “dumbing down” of the math curriculum in the name of DEI. John and I are on the same page on this one: How much longer are we going to pretend that this is doing any good for the students? The way that the Princeton school district went about implementing these curriculum standards was, at best, deceptive. Don’t parents have the right to know how decisions that affect their kids are being made? Of course, DEI is a business, one that has created thousands of jobs for administrators and consultants who spend their days rooting out racism. And as John points out, if someone’s job depends on finding instances of racism, they’re going to “find racism,” whether it’s really there or not. This incentive structure makes John despair. He also suggests that my theory of social capital may provide the conceptual underpinnings for some present-day arguments in favor of affirmative action. But I point out that, while social capital may partially explain disparities in outcome, it doesn’t excuse disparities in outcome. After all, we can see that, some historically disadvantaged groups regularly over-perform when high academic performance is incentivized within their community. But incentives for middling academic performance tend to produce middling academic performance, and I fear that we’re incentivizing middling academic performance in our young black students. Is there a way out of this mess? Is John right to despair? I close on a note of hope from my Brown University and Heterodox Academy colleague John Tomasi. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below. 0:00 John reports on his rustic Catskills bungalow 2:40 Parents protest Princeton public schools “dumbing down” their math curriculum  17:11 How much educational transparency is owed to parents?  25:07 How many DEI initiatives and administrators do we actually need?  33:50 John: I don’t think we can fix what’s broken in DEI 40:49 Glenn’s theory of social capital may explain (but does not excuse) some disparities 48:56 Cultures of achievement vs. disincentive effects of affirmative action 58:19 What do we know about what kids know about the world?  1:04:46 Glenn offers some reason for hope from John TomasiLinks and ReadingsJohn’s NYT piece, “Sometimes ‘Proper’ Speech Isn’t Correct Speech”The open letter from Princeton, New Jersey parentsBard College at Simon’s RockJohn’s book, Losing the Race: Self-Sabotage in Black AmericaJennifer Lee and Min Zhou’s book, The Asian American Achievement Paradox This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

For this week’s episode, I’m joined by NYU psychologist Jonathan Haidt, author of several books, including (with Greg Lukianoff) The Coddling of the American Mind: How Good Intentions and Bad Ideas Are Setting Up a Generation for Failure and The Righteous Mind: Why Good People Are Divided by Politics and Religion. Jonathan is also the co-founder of Heterodox Academy, where I serve on the advisory council. Despite that connection, this is our first extended public conversation. This is not, however, the first time I’ve engaged with Jon. After a talk some years ago, I asked Jon a question during the Q&A session, which I reintroduce here. Heterodox Academy’s mission is very important, but does focusing exclusively on viewpoint diversity prevent us from acknowledging that some viewpoints are more cogent than others? Jon’s recent Atlantic article “Why the Past 10 Years of American Life Have Been Uniquely Stupid” generated a lot of discussion, and he elaborates on his theory of “structural stupidity” here. He claims that, at the national level, the Republican Party’s hostility to moderation has made it structurally stupid and unable to examine its own premises, while left-dominated “epistemic institutions,” like journalism and academia, are mired in their own kind of structural stupidity. I find the structural analysis compelling, but I think it elides the fact that some of the Republicans’ policy position are not, in themselves, stupid at all. Jon is concerned that increasing intolerance on the left, especially on college campuses, may be caused by generational changes in child development. Gen Z is the first generation to have had access to social media as children, and they also had far less unsupervised free play than previous generations. I ask Jon whether this shift can account for groupthink around COVID-induced school shutdowns and drastic changes in attitudes toward trans and racial issues in the US. While the academy no doubt leans left, there is much more viewpoint diversity in economics departments than other areas. Jon has some interesting ideas about why. And finally, I ask Jon whether religion could play a role in increasing viewpoint diversity. It was great to finally connect with Jon. I hope and suspect it won’t be the last time we sit down for one of these conversations. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Glenn asks: Is Jon’s heterodoxy insufficiently pugilistic?  5:23 Jon’s theory of social media-driven “structural stupidity” 16:18 Do the Republican Party’s structural flaws negate its policies? 26:53 The rise of social media and the disappearance of free play for kids 35:42 Race, trans issues, and the future of the country 45:34 Why are economists uniquely heterodox thinkers in the academy? 48:08 What fills the “God-shaped hole” in the hearts of putatively secular Americans?Links and ReadingsHeterodox AcademyJon’s Atlantic article, “Why the Past 10 Years of American Life Have Been Uniquely Stupid” Jon’s book, with Greg Lukianoff, The Coddling of the American Mind: How Good Intentions and Bad Ideas Are Setting Up a Generation for FailureElizabeth Noelle-Neumann’s book, The Spiral of Silence: Public Opinion—Our Social SkinBrown University President Christina Paxson’s letter about racial justiceGlenn’s rebuttal to Paxson in City JournalJon’s childhood independence advocacy organization, Let GrowJon’s social media researchJames A. Morone’s book, Hellfire Nation: The Politics of Sin in American HistoryJohn Tierney and Roy F. Baumeister’s book, The Power of Bad: How the Negativity Effect Rules Us and How We Can Rule ItJohn McWhorter’s book, Woke Racism: How a New Religion Has Betrayed Black America This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John McWhorter is back once more for an episode of The Glenn Show, so let’s get into it. I begin by reporting on my current “European Tour.” Last week I spoke at the London School of Economics, and I’m currently headed from Toulouse, France to Marseille to deliver the keynote address at the International Conference on Public Economic Theory. It’s been quite an enlightening experience so far, as I’ve gotten a look at how young black European economists are thinking about inequities within and without their profession. John and I discuss a recent report from the Commission on Race and Ethnic Disparities, which offers a picture of racial disparities in the UK that differs greatly from that of the US. But as John notes, the impression that people abroad have of our problems is often distorted. One of our real problems is our tendency to filter all thinking about race and ethnicity through “blacks and whites.” The US is a much more diverse place that that, and John and I ask how long the concerns of African Americans will determine the national agenda for all “people of color.” Next, John asks a big question: What is the real cause of racial disparities in the commission of violent crime? We know that black perpetrators are responsible for a disproportionate amount of violent crime, but we need to understand why. I gently chide John for missing the recent Old Parkland Conference, but he’s got a good excuse: He was busy recording a series of lectures about the history of the alphabet for the Great Courses! I am utterly fascinated by this project, and I convince John to give us a preview. And finally, I offer a critique of John’s recent column, which addresses school shootings. This one is buoyant and weighty in equal measure. As always, I want to hear your thoughts. Let me know in the comments!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Race and economics in the UK 14:26 How long will the concerns of native-born black Americans drive the race conversation? 23:15 The shaky “people of color” coalition 27:51 Trying to account for racial disparities in the commission of violent crime 39:44 Reclaiming moral agency from white people 42:37 The Old Parkland conference 44:37 John’s forthcoming lectures on the alphabet 51:47 Glenn’s critique of John’s school shooting columnLinks and ReadingsThe “Sewell Report” from the UK’s Commission on Race and Ethnic DisparitiesAmy Chua and Jed Rubenfeld’s book, The Triple Package: How Three Unlikely Traits Explain the Rise and Fall of Cultural Groups in AmericaEzra Klein’s interview with Reihan SalamGlenn and John’s conversation with Randall KennedyIan Rowe’s book, Agency: The Four Point Plan (F.R.E.E.) for ALL Children to Overcome the Victimhood Narrative and Discover Their Pathway to PowerJohn’s recent NYT column, “Gun Violence Is Like What Segregation Was. An Unaddressed Moral Stain.” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Earlier this year, I announced that I would be donating 10% of the net income from this newsletter to the Woodson Center to support the vital work that they do. I also want to use the newsletter and TGS as a platform to promote the work of Woodson Center-affiliated organizations that are making change on the ground in communities around the country. My first guest in what I hope will be a long ongoing series is Sylvia Bennett-Stone, Director of Voices of Black Mothers United, who is joined by Robert Woodson himself. Sylvia and Bob were on hand at the recent Old Parkland Conference, where I had the honor of speaking, so we sat down for an in-person discussion. (You can also read the great essayist Gerald Early’s account of the conference). I had Sylvia on the show last year, but VBMU’s work supporting mothers who have lost children to violent crime is so powerful and so important that I thought it appropriate to have her back. Bob begins by introducing the mission of the Woodson Center, which provides support to “social entrepreneurs” who work within communities to help solve the toughest problems facing them today: crime, poverty, academic achievement, and many others. Sylvia then talks about a recent five-city tour that she undertook with VBMU to support victims of violence and to raise awareness for victims’ rights. Sylvia recounts how the loss of her daughter moved her to reach out to help other mothers who are suffering. Sylvia is clear that, in order to prevent more deaths, more police are needed in black communities, and good relations need to be maintained between law enforcement and the people they serve. As Bob points out, contrary to what many progressive activists claim, efforts to defund the police are unpopular in black communities with high crime rates. The subject of forgiveness comes up more than once in this conversation. Sylvia and Bob tell me about instances in which the mothers of slain children not only forgive the perpetrators but sometimes reach out to them in prison. This remarkable fact suggests to me that there is a strong Christian influence in VBMU, which Sylvia and Bob affirm, though Sylvia notes that they support whoever needs their help, regardless of religious affiliation. I wonder why, given the importance of Christianity in many black communities, we hear so little about it in the media. We end with a final word from Sylvia, who urges anyone struggling with the pain of losing a child to reach out to VBMU.Sylvia and Bob are doing vital, necessary work, and I am so proud that all of us here are able to support them. And if you want to make additional donations, please visit the websites for the Woodson Center and Voices of Black Mothers United.Unfortunately, we only had a little over a half hour for our conversation. So to round out this week’s episode, I’m including a speech I delivered when I accepted the Bradley Prize in a ceremony in Washington, D.C. earlier this month. It was a tremendous honor, and I want to share the moment with all of you here. Ten percent of net revenue from this newsletter goes to support the Woodson Center and programs like Voices of Black Mothers United. To help support these absolutely essential organizations, become a subscriber to this newsletter, or donate directly to the Woodson Center and Voice of Black Mothers United.0:00 The work of the Woodson Center 2:26 Sylvia’s recent five-city tour to support victims of violence 4:40 How tragedy moved Sylvia to start Voices of Black Mothers United 9:29 Sylvia: We must work with the police in our communities 13:38 What role does race play in VBMU’s work? And where are the fathers? 18:20 The importance of forgiveness in the healing process 22:07 How VBMU is reaching out beyond black communities 25:23 Sylvia: The pain of mothers who lose children to police violence is no different than mine 28:39 Glenn: Why do we hear so little about Christian faith’s role in healing? 34:10 Glenn's Bradley Prize acceptance speech, May 17, 2022LinksThe Woodson CenterVoices of Black Mothers United This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week, I’m back with my friend John McWhorter. A lot has happened since we last spoke, so let’s get to it. We begin by discussing the horrific, racially motivated mass shooting in Buffalo, New York. John states that, among other things, the event makes him wish we had a word besides “racism” to help us distinguish between truly racist acts like that shooting and situations where there may be racial disparities but no actual racism present. One of the shooter’s motivations was so-called “great replacement” theory, or the idea that there is a conspiracy on the part of Democrats or Jews or whoever to “replace” large parts of the white population in the US with Latino immigrants. Tucker Carlson has given much airtime to a version of this theory (though without any overt antisemitism), and I’ve appeared on one of Tucker Carlson’s shows in the past. John asks me if I think Tucker is indirectly responsible for stirring up ugly sentiments toward immigrants of the short held by the shooter. I respond that, while I don’t endorse everything Tucker says on his show, I don’t believe him to be a racist. After all, Democrats often point to the impact that the country’s shifting demographics may have on elections. We need to be able to debate the immigration issue on its merits. It’s perfectly legitimate to believe that we need tighter controls on who is allowed to live in this country, and one ought to be able to say so without being charged with racism or xenophobia. We move on to last week’s Bradley Prize ceremony, where I received the honor and delivered a speech. John recounts a time when a white woman condescendingly gave him a book by Walter Mosley in an attempt to “educate” him. The incident turned John off of Mosley’s writing, but he’s come back to it, and he is delighted by what he’s found. (When is Mosley going to get a Pulitzer or a National Book Award? It’s past time!) And finally, we discuss the difficult problem of mass shootings, mental illness, and the second amendment. I grab hold of more than one third rail in this one. As always, I want to hear your thoughts. Post them below!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 John: We need a word besides “racism” to distinguish racial inequities from what happened in Buffalo 10:49 Glenn: I don’t agree with everything Tucker Carlson says, but he’s not a racist 20:22 Demographic change is happening in the US, but how should we understand it? 28:07 What does Tucker think he’s doing and what is he actually doing? 36:21 Glenn: We should be able to freely debate immigration policy without evoking racial tropes 46:31 Glenn accepts the Bradley Prize at the organization’s gala  51:13 How a white woman’s condescension stopped John from reading Walter Mosley 57:42 Can we disentangle incidents like the Buffalo shooting from ideology? 1:02:34 A correction from GlennLinks and ReadingsJohn’s book, Woke RacismGlenn Greenwald’s Substack post, “The Demented - and Selective - Game of Instantly Blaming Political Opponents For Mass Shootings”Part 1 of the NYT’s series on Tucker Carlson Glenn and John discussing whether Glenn should appear on Tucker Carlson’s showA partial transcript of Glenn’s appearance on Tucker Carlson’s showGlenn and John discussing Glenn’s appearance on Tucker Carlson’s showJohn’s NYT column on Walter Mosley This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week’s episode is a throwback to 2015, when Daniel Kaufman, professor of philosophy at Missouri State University, editor of the online magazine the Electric Agora, and (at that time) a mainstay on bloggingheads.tv and meaningoflife.tv, invited me onto his show Sophia. I stumbled across this video again last month, and I think it remains an illuminating discussion that addresses some fundamental questions about economics and the social sciences. We begin by discussing the “science” part of the social sciences. I explain that we economists tend not to philosophize about our discipline as much as other social scientists. But many major economic thinkers (think Keynes, Marx, and others) elaborate concepts that do ask fundamental questions about the nature of economics. To call a discipline a “science” implies that its findings are testable and replicable, that its insights are able to predict future conditions from present conditions. Does economics do that? I argue that it does. Of course, since much economic data is drawn from real-world behavior rather than controlled experiments, it can be difficult to isolate variables in a way that would satisfy, say, a physicist. This is because markets exist within particular cultures and under particular social arrangements that are not themselves purely economic in nature. And cultural values are going to affect, at least to some extent, how people behave within markets. The idea that people will try to maximize utility in a rational way is important to economics, but of course we know that humans often behave in ways that seem irrational. How does economics incorporate irrationality into its methodology? And finally, Dan and I were speaking at a time when the (still ongoing) replication crisis was all over the news. Is replication as seemingly dire a problem in economics as it is in psychology? Dan’s training in philosophy helps him to ask some really deep questions here, and I think you can tell I relished the opportunity to answer them. Love to know what you think about this “classic” episode. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.5:44 How scientific are the social sciences? 11:20 Glenn defends the reliability of economic predictions 29:47 The strengths and weaknesses of “natural experiments” 36:48 How much does culture affect economic behavior? 50:06 New insights from behavioral economics 58:12 Dan: We trust the social sciences too muchLinks and ReadingsDan’s website, the Electric AgoraThe Electric Agora on YouTubeSendhil Mullainathan and Eldar Shafir’a book, Scarcity: The New Science of Having Less and How It Defines Our Lives This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week’s plan for the show was to have Edmund Santurri, professor of philosophy and religion at St. Olaf College, join John McWhorter and I to talk about his soon-to-be terminated appointment as the director of the college’s Institute for Freedom & Community. Ed’s situation is the latest instance of a college’s administration folding to pressure from left-wing activists (more on that below). Unfortunately, Ed was only able to join us for the very beginning of this episode before tech glitches had their way with us. Ed’s story is important, and I do wish we had been able to carry on a full conversation, but it was not to be. We do make some headway, though. Ed begins by explaining how, after he invited a series of speakers viewed by some as controversial, St. Olaf’s administration announced that they would remove him from his role as director of the Institute for Freedom & Community a year earlier than had been agreed upon. One might ask: What good is an institute devoted to free inquiry if it refuses to engage with controversial ideas? Ed begins to explain the recent history of student protests at the college, but we’re then forced to whittle our trialogue down to a dialogue. John expresses his disgust for the St. Olaf administrators responsible for Ed’s removal (which I share) and talks about the important work of FIRE, the Foundation for Individual Rights in Education. We then debate whether there is a right-wing equivalent to left-wing campus cancel culture. I don’t think there is, but John thinks one can be found in attempts to remove books dealing with gender and sexuality from public grade schools and attempts to remove trans, nonbinary, and gender fluid teachers from classrooms. He’s not that worried about nonbinary gender identity in children. But I have to confess, I think the performative dimension of that sort of expression may be an indicator of a worrisome direction in our society. We then move on to something about which everyone can agree: My house is awesome. John visited it for the first time last week when he was in Providence for my festschrift, a conference held in my honor in which many of my dear and distinguished friends gathered to discuss my work and its impact. It was a moving and humbling event, and we’re hoping to post some video from it here soon. We finish our conversation with an extended debate about the Supreme Court’s upcoming decision that will almost certainly overturn Roe v. Wade and the political environment that led to a draft of Samuel Alito’s majority opinion being leaked to the press. It’s good to have John back after his absence. I know you’ll all have some things to say about this one, so don’t hesitate to post a comment. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Why Ed is being removed from the directorship of the Institute for Freedom & Community 11:39 The pressure campaigns waged against past Institute events 17:43 John: Administrators at St. Olaf should be ashamed of themselves 19:50 Are right-wing campaigns against openly trans and nonbinary elementary school teachers the equivalent of left-wing cancel culture?  29:05 What are the social determinants of gender identity in young people? 37:53 Glenn’s awesome house 41:18 A festschrift for Glenn  48:08 Can we separate jurisprudence from the lived consequences of overturning Roe v. Wade?  56:12 Do the ends now justify the means in American politics?Links and ReadingsInside Higher Ed on Ed’s removal from the Institute for Freedom & CommunityFIRE, the Foundation for Individual Rights in EducationFIRE’s letter to St. Olaf’s president protesting Ed’s removal This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week, I welcome Briahna Joy Gray to TGS. I’ve appeared on her podcast, Bad Faith, and now she’s here to return the favor. Briahna and I have some pretty pronounced political differences—she’s the former National Press Secretary for Bernie Sanders’s presidential campaign, after all. But we get along anyway, because we both believe in the importance of free speech and open debate. And make no mistake, there is a lot of debate in this episode. [Note: We recorded this conversation at Brown’s Watson Institute for International and Public Affairs, and there was no video equipment on hand. Instead, Nikita Petrov has created an animation version of me to provide some visual stimulation.]I may be uncomfortable saying that I’m a “man of the right,” but I’m certainly “conservative for a black guy.” But Briahna points out that there are many black people who have benefited from America’s economic opportunities and know it. They may vote Democrat, but they’re hardly socialists. Many conservatives say that their voices are shut out of mainstream discourse, and the left has a similar complaint. I point out that the Democratic Party has repeatedly undercut Bernie Sanders’s presidential campaigns, and Briahna explains why Democrats have been and continue to be hostile toward progressive policies and politicians. She argues that neither Democratic nor Republican policies reflect the actual desires of the majority of voters, as political parties no longer need to vie for broad majorities in order to win elections. After that, the debate begins in earnest. We address three major points of contention: increasing taxes on the very rich in order to expand the social safety net, Medicare for All, and student debt cancellation. I’m skeptical of all of these policies, to varying degrees, while Briahna believes they’re necessary in order to remedy the (admittedly vast) disparities we see all around us. We wrap up by discussing the fascinating convergence between certain factions of the left and right in criticizing what appears to be a march toward escalating US intervention in Ukraine. I enjoy a good debate, and I suspect that Briahna does, too. Maybe that’s why, despite our differences, we get along so well. Let me know what you think in the comments. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Acknowledging the black middle class 14:04 How the Democratic Party works against progressives 21:11 Briahna: The interests of political parties no longer reflect the interests of voters 26:53 Should we increase taxes on the very rich in order to fund the social safety net? 34:51 Briahna makes the case for Medicare for All 43:21 Should we cancel student debt? 54:30 The left-right alliance over intervention in UkraineBad Faith’s Patreon pageBen Carson’s book, Gifted Hands: The Ben Carson StoryMartin Gilens and Benjamin Page’s 2014 study, “Testing Theories of American Politics: Elites, Interest Groups, and Average Citizens”Vann R. Newkirk II’s Atlantic piece, “The American Health-Care System Increases Income Inequality” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Normally I would post one of my bi-weekly conversations with John McWhorter today, but John and I had too many scheduling conflicts to find time to talk this week (he’ll return in two weeks). So in his stead, I’m talking with Greg Thomas, co-founder of the Jazz Leadership Project and senior fellow at the Institute for Cultural Evolution.We begin by discussing Greg’s work with the Jazz Leadership Project, which uses the principles of jazz to train leaders within businesses and organizations. He’s got some big-league clients, so I was interested to know how Greg implements ideas and strategies from an originally African American art form within a corporate environment. Greg was a friend of the great critic, poet, and novelist Stanley Crouch, and I ask him about how they came to know each other. This leads us to discuss the intellectual lineage that runs from Ralph Ellison and Albert Murray through Crouch. These thinkers were deeply rooted in black art, culture, and politics, but they were also, to varying degrees, skeptical of race as a foundational concept. Is there anyone now continuing this tradition? Greg talks about his own efforts in that direction, but he also notes that the modern Enlightenment tradition, which sought a scientific foundation for knowledge and institutions, has been at least partially displaced by postmodern thought, which seeks to critique the Enlightenment. Greg argues that such a critique is fine, so long as we don’t abandon modernity’s gains. He then introduces some ideas from integral theory and from the philosopher Anthony Appiah that he believes can help reconcile the need both to preserve culturally specific traditions and to claim membership in a broader cosmopolitan community. And finally, Greg tells me about some of his daughter’s impressive accomplishments, including building the We Read Too app. I really enjoyed having Greg on as a guest, and I hope to have him back on for an episode with both John and I soon.This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Greg’s work with the Jazz Leadership Project 12:35 How does a “black” art form operate within a corporate environment? 17:27 What’s left of the legacy of Ralph Ellison, Albert Murray, and Stanley Crouch? 25:04 Black culture after the postmodern turn 32:45 Greg’s work with the Institute for Cultural Evolution 36:40 Greg’s critique of Black Lives Matter 40:48 Rooted cosmopolitanism and the “Faustian bargain” of whiteness 50:46 Greg’s very accomplished daughterLinks and ReadingsThe Jazz Leadership ProjectThe Institute for Cultural EvolutionGreg’s Substack post, “Why Race-Based Framings of Social Issues Hurt Us All” Stanley Crouch’s Notes of a Hanging Judge: Essays and Reviews, 1979-1989 Video from Combating Racism and Antisemitism TogetherSteve McIntosh’s Developmental Politics: How America Can Grow Into a Better Version of ItselfCharles Love’s Race Crazy: BLM, 1619, and the Progressive Racism MovementKwame Anthony Appiah’s, Cosmopolitanism: Ethics in a World of StrangersDanielle Allen Resmaa Menakem, My Grandmother's Hands: Racialized Trauma and the Pathway to Mending Our Hearts and BodiesKaya Thomas Wilson’s We Read Too app  This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

On this week’s episode of The Glenn Show, I welcome my old friend Stephanie Lepp, the Executive Producer at the Center for Humane Technology. I first met Stephanie through her husband, Nathaniel, who was a student of mine at Brown. Stephanie produced a podcast called Reckonings, which told the stories of how people transform their worldviews. I went on the show in 2015 and told the story of the evolution of my own political worldview (links below). Since then, we've been wanting to do another round. It's time! This time, Stephanie joins me on The Glenn Show, to once again help me wrestle with how my views have changed and with my responsibilities as a public intellectual.Stephanie begins by asking me to step back and consider a big-picture question: What is my goal as a public intellectual? It’s not something I often ask myself in such explicit terms, and Stephanie pushes me to articulate a response. Stephanie engages me on the affirmative action question in order to get me to speak not just about my critique of preferences, but to think about whether critique is enough. It’s one thing to criticize a program or idea, she says, and another to propose a solution. I agree, of course, but the critique does have to be made, and not just in the case of affirmative action. I see it as my job to make clear that the systemic prejudices affirmative action programs were designed to ameliorate are largely in the past. When we see large-scale failure in black communities today, the responsibility for those failures rests, to a great extent, on the shoulders of the members of those communities. Stephanie suggests that, given my position as a public intellectual, when I speak about these problems, I not only describe social reality but actually influence it. If that is true (and I’m not sure to what extent it is), should I reorient my way of engaging with matters of public concern? Stephanie says, “Evolution is beautiful, but it’s not pretty.” This leads me to wonder: Is our present political turmoil an ugly but necessary process that will result in improvement over time, if properly attended to? I'm doubtful. Finally, I offer a critique of Stephanie’s own brand of “promiscuous pragmatic pluralism.”It was such a pleasure to reconnect with an old friend and talk through these issues. I’m looking forward to your thoughts!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 What is Glenn’s goal as a public intellectual?11:12 Glenn has his critique of affirmative action … 21:57 … but is articulating the critique enough?  27:23 Glenn: My raison d’être is to give voice to my contempt for the failures of my people 36:36 Stephanie: At a certain point, you’re not describing reality, you’re influencing it 43:02 The case for integralism  51:39 “Evolution is beautiful, but it’s not pretty” 1:00:06 Glenn’s critique of Stephanie’s “promiscuous pragmatic pluralism”  1:06:47 A preliminary look into the married life of the LourysReckonings, “The Conscience of a Public Intellectual, pt. 1”Reckonings, “The Conscience of a Public Intellectual, pt. 2”Reckonings, “The Enemy Within”Chloé Valdary’s Theory of EnchantmentKen Wilber’s A Theory of Everything: An Integral Vision for Business, Politics, Science, and Spirituality This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week, John and I are talking about the ten-year anniversary of the Trayvon Martin shooting, one of the most politically consequential events of the 2010s. A decade later, are we in a better place than where we started? John and I begin by discussing the New York Times’s recent package commemorating the event, which features a written piece by Charles Blow and video interviews with Barack Obama, Henry Louis Gates, and Al Sharpton. All of them reinforce the mainstream narrative about Martin’s death—that he had been senselessly attacked by Zimmerman for no reason. Yet much evidence supports Zimmerman’s story: that he shot Martin in self-defense after Martin assaulted him. John discusses how his skepticism toward the mainstream Trayvon Martin narrative contributed to the end of his relationship with The Root. My own skepticism continues to pose challenges for me, as many of my students resist when I ask them to consider the facts of the case rather than the “poetic truth” the case has come to represent. John suggests that we can learn from recalling how the O.J. Simpson trial unfolded. The public story about the trial had more to do with race and the cops than it did with the brutal murder of two innocent people, even if most people now acknowledge that Simpson’s not guilty verdict was mistaken. There are people contesting the mainstream narratives around Martin and Michael Brown, including excellent documentaries by Joel Gilbert and Shelby and Eli Steele. These counternarratives are vital correctives, but where are the consequences for those who continue to push bogus information? And we end with a bit of a palate cleanser, with John taking us through the life and work of Scott Joplin. Is there a way, at this late date, to turn the narratives about Martin, Michael Brown, and others around? How can we turn back the tide unleashed by these events and their political afterlife? Let me know your thoughts. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 The NYT commemorates the tenth anniversary of Trayvon Martin’s death 7:20 What really happened between Martin and George Zimmerman? 14:35 How John’s relationship with The Root frayed 19:33 Learning from the O.J. Simpson case 32:24 Trayvon Martin and Michael Brown on the big and small screen 40:55 Where are the consequences for those who get it wrong? 46:00 Remembering Scott JoplinLinks and ReadingsThe NYT’s Trayvon Martin anniversary package Joel Gilbert’s book, The Trayvon Hoax: Unmasking the Witness Fraud That Divided AmericaJoel Gilbert’s documentary, The Trayvon Hoax: Unmasking the Witness Fraud That Divided AmericaEli and Shelby Steele’s documentary, What Killed Michael Brown?Rest in Power: The Trayvon Martin StoryJason Riley’s WSJ opinion piece, “Will Amazon Suppress the True Michael Brown Story?”The 2015 DOJ statement announcing the closure of the investigation of the Trayvon Martin shootingJohn’s NYT piece, “Scott Joplin’s Ragtime Is Ambrosia. Here’s Why It Matters.” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Over the last couple years, I’ve been in communication with Noam Dworman, the owner of the Comedy Cellar in New York, which is one of the most influential comedy clubs in the country. He suggested that we collaborate and put together a show that would explore the relationship between truth, free speech, and comedy. After a lot of back and forth, we came up with the idea of putting non-comedian intellectuals into conversation with professional stand-up comics. We weren’t quite sure what would happen, but we both sensed the idea had great potential.And so, last month, The Glenn Show held its first live event. Roland Fryer, Coleman Hughes, and I served as the “serious” participants, and Noam invited the comics Andrew Schulz, Judy Gold, Shane Gillis, T.J., and Rick Crom to come up and offer their thoughts. The event also included special appearances from Nikki Jax and the stellar Sam Jay. Noam and I wanted to know, are there certain truths that only comics can get away with telling? Can delivering a potentially unsettling idea in comedic form make people more receptive to it? The place was packed—tickets sold out in just a few days. The atmosphere was electric. After I introduced the event and kicked things off with an opening provocation, the show took on a life of its own. As you’ll see, the comics took the idea and ran with it. There are moments of chaos, moments of profundity, and a lot of laughs. I couldn’t have asked for a better live debut for TGS, and I am excited to be able to share with all of you who made it possible through your support.We’re planning on doing more of these events in the future, so let us know what you think!Many, many thanks to Noam Dworman for his hard work, generosity, and for providing video and audio of the event. The title sequence was created by our own Nikita Petrov. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Some unspeakable truths 8:07 Are comics now afraid to speak their minds onstage? 19:38 The difference between telling the truth and getting a laugh 28:42 Can jokes actually do harm? 36:50 Nikki Jax on comedy and trans issues 43:34 Who actually “cancels” comics, audiences or corporations? 50:26 Sam Jay on artistic freedom and mob mentality 55:55 Q&A: I’m worried people won’t understand that my one-woman show is satire. What should I do? 58:42 Q&A: Does comedy have real power or is it ‘just jokes’? 1:06:35 Q&A: Do comics sometimes inadvertently reinforce wrongheaded points of view? 1:10:23 Q&A: Why are Ivy Leaguers so unfunny? 1:13:13 Q&A: Are college campuses inhospitable environments for comedy? 1:16:45 Q&A: What got Roland suspended at Harvard? 1:20:20 Q&A: Does the general public need social media training? 1:22:31 Q&A: Is there a way to stop corporations from folding to social media pressure campaigns? This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week I welcome Sam Harris to TGS. Sam is a neuroscientist and philosopher, the host of the podcast Making Sense, and the proprietor of the meditation app Waking Up. He’s a searching, truly open-minded thinker who follows the evidence where it leads, even if that means admitting that he was wrong about a previously held position. We begin by discussing Sam’s uncertainty about how to navigate some aspects of the discourse on race. He wants a world in which race simply doesn’t matter all that much, but he’s unsure of how to bring that world into being. Sam highlights the stakes of the affirmative action question by asking us to imagine that we have to undergo brain surgery at the hands of a surgeon who got through medical school despite relatively low performance. Would we want this surgeon operating on us or our children? (I raised a similar concern in the past.) We then move on to Charles Murray, who Sam has had as a guest on his podcast. Sam was appalled by Charles’s treatment at Middlebury College, where he was violently deplatformed by a group of student protesters. Sam shares my view that nobody, and especially not a figure as significant as Charles, should be prevented from airing their views in public, no matter how wrongheaded we might find them. (For the record, I don’t find Charles to be “wrongheaded.”) If you disagree with a speaker, argue with them. We know that certain groups perform worse on tests and other quantifiable measures of academic performance than others, but we’re not yet sure why. Sam asks an intriguing question: Are there certain things we’re better off not knowing? If we knew that a given group had an inherent, perhaps ineradicable disadvantage on quantifiable measurements of performance, would we want to know? Could the social ill that such knowledge might produce make us worse off than the social good that would come from it? We then consider whether there are still circumstances in which affirmative action is necessary. From there, we pivot to God. Sam is, famously, a critic of organized religion. But religion is one thing and belief in God another. Sam frames the question of belief as one that can be addressed through mindful introspection. But at the level of community, it seems more difficult to find a secular alternative to the networks of support and spiritual sustenance that many find in temples, churches, synagogues, and mosques. I had a great time thinking along with Sam. There is much more that we could have discussed had time allowed, so hopefully he’ll join me again soon.Note: We encountered some problems with Sam’s audio. As a result, the sound quality on his end is less than optimal. Many apologies. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 The principle that race shouldn’t matter and the fact that it does 6:17 The high stakes of affirmative action 17:00 In defense of Charles Murray 25:35 Are there facts we’re better off not knowing? 36:30 When does affirmative action make sense and when is it counterproductive? 48:01 Is belief in God irrational? 52:32 Suffering and the illusion of self 1:00:27 Finding meaning in secular communityLinks and ReadingsSam’s booksSam’s podcast, Making SenseSam’s app, Waking Up This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week on The Glenn Show, John McWhorter and I are joined by the journalist Matt Taibbi. Many of you are likely familiar with Matt from his many books, his political journalism for Rolling Stone (among other outlets), his Useful Idiots podcast, and now his outstanding Substack newsletter, TK News. Matt lived and worked in Russia and the former USSR for several years, so I thought he’d be an excellent source for some insight into the war in Ukraine. We begin by discussing Matt’s brief career playing in the MBA—that’s the Mongolian Basketball Association. We then move on to more pressing matters. Like many journalists and experts, Matt had been confident that Putin would not invade Ukraine. Unlike many journalists and experts, he issued an apology to his readers for making the wrong call and explained what led him to make it. Even after the invasion, it’s not clear why Putin is pushing as far west as he is—we talk about the difficult of getting inside his head. I ask if the media’s portrayal of Putin as a true autocrat is accurate, and Matt affirms that, while it’s hard to know what’s really going on inside the Russian government, Putin does seem to have more or less total control of domestic and military policy. The best way to deal with Russia is to first understand how it sees the world, so how do we put ourselves in its geopolitical shoes? This exercise leads John to reflect on his own lack of tribalistic feelings, and how tribalism is driving Russian and Ukrainian responses to the war. Shouldn’t all this feel a little familiar to Americans? Can we apply the lessons we learned (or should have learned) in our own disastrous wars in Afghanistan and Iraq to Ukraine? Matt was an early and vociferous critic of Russiagate, the discredited idea that Russian interference swung the 2016 election in Trump’s favor. But has the hangover from Russiagate made it difficult to view Russia’s actions clearly? And why have those who were wrong about Russiagate (and many, many other things) continued to exert influence in the media despite never admitting to the kind of errors that would have ended careers not so long ago? Matt argues that journalism is no longer about reporting news but about building narratives, and that media outlets are now rewarded primarily for keeping their viewers angry. We then move on to cultural matters. I’m a great fan of classic Russian literature, and I ask Matt to recommend some modern Russian writers. And finally, the big question: Who’s going to triumph in the NBA Eastern Conference, the Celtics or the Nets? Many thanks to Matt Taibbi for dropping in. Hopefully we’ll be able to get him back on TGS in the not-too-distant future. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Matt’s brief career as a professional basketball player in Mongolia 5:45 What drove Putin to invade Ukraine? 14:54 Are there limits to Putin’s power in Russia? 19:33 Putting ourselves in Russia’s geopolitical shoes 27:35 The appeal of Russian nationalism 30:55 Did we learn anything from Iraq and Afghanistan? 36:25 Did Russiagate obscure Americans’ ability to see Russia’s actions clearly? 40:08 The value of public apologies 41:28 Matt: Journalists are now in the narrative business 49:45 The foreign policy language barrier 55:00 Matt’s recommends some modern Russian writers 58:18 Matt answers the most pressing question of our time: Celtics or Nets?Links and ReadingsMatt’s newsletter, TK NewsKatie Halper and Matt’s podcast, Useful IdiotsMatt’s mea culpa on the Russian invasion of UkraineWesley Lowery’s NYT piece, “A Reckoning Over Objectivity, Led by Black Journalists” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

With the war in Ukraine escalating, I thought it would be a good idea to bring on a guest with some expertise in international relations. So I called on Daniel Bessner, an intellectual historian, associate professor at University of Washington’s Henry M. Jackson School of International Studies, and a co-host of the American Prestige podcast. Daniel is a man of the left, so we spend a lot of time here arguing, and we have a great time doing it.Note: We recorded on February 22, 2022. Between then and now, the situation in Ukraine has changed quite a bit. In order to avoid confusion, we have edited out a portion of the conversation that is no longer up-to-date.Daniel and I begin by discussing what Putin’s invasion of Ukraine might tell us about the US’s standing in the world. Daniel argues that Putin’s willingness to ignore the US’s warnings reflects the decline of America’s global hegemony. He compares the present situation to America’s geopolitical position in the wake of World War II, arguing that the US imputed unrealistic hegemonic ambitions to the Soviet Union in order to justify the Cold War. He worries that the lesson many nations will draw from Ukraine is that the best way to forestall aggression from a stronger state is to acquire nuclear weapons. Unfortunately, this strategy makes a lot of sense to me. We then take a hard turn away from war to talk about Whoopi Goldberg. Daniel and I agree that the outrage over her remarks about the Holocaust is completely overblown. But he sees in this outrage the sign of a frustrated populace with no other way to express its political will. I’m skeptical of the idea we should want a return to mass politics, though. We shouldn’t throw the fate of our institutions to the political winds. We then debate the role of private industry in administering services to the public. We agree that our public schools are in bad shape, but Daniel thinks that market logic is at the root of the problem, whereas I think the market can help offer solutions. The question of meritocracy emerges, and Daniel argues that real meritocracy is impossible within a highly unequal society. No doubt that’s a problem, but I think abandoning meritocratic principles would be a huge mistake. And finally, we get into a debate over the uses (and possible abuses) of game theory.I truly enjoyed this good-natured sparring match with Daniel, and I hope you do, too!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Daniel: Putin’s actions in Ukraine demonstrate the decline of American global hegemony 7:02 Did the Soviet Union have the same expansionist ambitions as the US? 16:01 How the war in Ukraine could increase nuclear proliferation 23:46 Daniel: It’s absurd that people got so upset about Whoopi Goldberg’s Holocaust comment 27:27 Does the US have “mass politics” anymore? If not, is that a bad thing? 34:35 When does it pay to privatize? 38:55 What’s so bad about utopianism? 44:18 Is true meritocracy possible within a highly unequal society? 58:04 The uses (and possible abuses) of game theoryLinks and ReadingsGlenn’s Intellectual Origins, a series of interviews with DanielDaniel’s podcast, American PrestigeDaniel’s most recent appearance on Chapo Trap HouseStephen Wertheim’s book, Tomorrow, the World: The Birth of U.S. World SupremacyPaul Chamberlin’s book, The Cold War’s Killing Fields: Rethinking the Long PeaceDerek Masters and Katharine Way’s book, One World or None: A Report to the Public on the Full Meaning of the Atomic BombDaniel’s essay, “The End of Mass Politics”Walter Lippmann’s book, Public OpinionWalter Lippmann’s book, The Phantom PublicGlenn’s book, The Anatomy of Racial InequalityDaniel Markovitz’s book, The Meritocracy Trap: How America's Foundational Myth Feeds Inequality, Dismantles the Middle Class, and Devours the EliteKenneth Arrow’s book, Social Choice and Individual ValuesPaul Erickson’s, The World the Game Theorists MadeS.M. Amadae’s book, Rationalizing Capitalist Democracy: The Cold War Origins of Rational Choice LiberalismRobert Fogel and Stanley Engerman’s book, Time on the Cross: The Economics of American Slavery This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

It’s John McWhorter time once again here at The Glenn Show. Let’s get into it. John and I are both busy guys, but people might not realize how much juggling it takes to manage life as both an academic and a public intellectual. I talk about why I may soon wind down my role at Brown University and devote myself more fully to public endeavors. We then move on to discuss psychiatrist Jeffrey Lieberman, who has been fired or suspended from several academic and medical appointments after referring to Sudanese model Nyakim Gatwech as a possible “freak of nature” in a tweet. It was a tacky, poorly worded tweet, no doubt. But clearly Lieberman was attempting to compliment Gatwech in the same way one might might refer to an unusually gifted athlete as a “freak.” John and I ask, does Lieberman really deserve to have his life destroyed over this? We then move on to discuss how the word “Negro” is now getting the n-word treatment in some quarters. To me, there is absolutely no justification for eliminating the word “Negro” from our lexicon, especially since it was once used to confer dignity on black people. Relatedly, John reports that efforts to replace “Latino” and “Latina” with “Latinx” are not faring well outside of academic circles. The question of when to capitalize “black” comes up, and I discuss why we don’t do so here at the Substack and why I’m opposed to doing so in general. We ask why children who come from families with highly varied racial and ethnic backgrounds are still often raised as “black” in the US if even one of their parents or grandparents is black. Why does blackness take precedence? We close on two unrelated topics. The first addresses whether or not academic tenure is necessary. The second addresses the very grim situation in Ukraine and Europe more broadly.It’s always a pleasure to talk with John, and I hope you enjoy the conversation!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Glenn contemplates exiting academia 7:28 Why should Jeffrey Lieberman lose his jobs over a tacky tweet? 15:11 The historical significance of the word “Negro” 24:05 The revolt against “Latinx” 27:49 Why Glenn doesn’t capitalize “black” 34:04 Why does “blackness” take precedence? 40:09 Glenn: Tenure without mandatory retirement can be a problem 49:31 Will the US send troops to Ukraine?Links and ReadingsJohn’s NYT piece, “One Graceless Tweet Doesn’t Warrant Cancellation”William Levi Dawson’s Negro Folk SymphonyThe New York Times book, How Race Is Lived in America: Pulling Together, Pulling ApartJohn’s NYT piece, “I Can’t Brook the Idea of Banning ‘Negro’”John’s NYT piece, “Capitalizing ‘Black’ Isn’t Wrong. But It Isn’t That Helpful, Either.”Thomas Chatterton Williams’s book Self-Portrait in Black and White: Family, Fatherhood, and Rethinking RaceStanley Crouch’s book, Notes of a Hanging Judge: Essays and Reviews, 1979-1989 This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week, I welcome Matt Rosenberg to TGS. Matt is a journalist who grew up in Chicago’s Hyde Park neighborhood and the author of the recently published book What Next, Chicago?: Notes of a Pissed-Off Native Son. The book delves into the causes and effects of the city’s recent, alarming rise in crime and also chronicles those who are trying to address the problem. As a native of Chicago’s South Side, I share Matt’s concerns, and I highly, highly recommend that everyone read his book. We begin by talking about Matt’s personal connection to the city, and his memories of the Yippie protests at the 1968 Democratic National Convention. Matt explains what drove him to return to Chicago after leaving the city years ago. He then gets into the deep relationship between street crime and political corruption in the city. He notes that he’s not the only person covering these stories, but there are few journalists making systematic efforts to connect the dots between them. It’s not all bad news from Chicago, though. Matt discusses a few organizations that are making change at the grassroots level, including Corey Brooks’s outstanding Project H.O.O.D. We move on to one the city’s most pressing problems: schools. Matt underscores the necessity of school choice and charter school funding in a city where many public schools are underserving students and parents. One under-discussed but important story Matt covers is Chicago’s sizable and thriving Latino communities. He finds them full of hard-working, family-oriented folks who are making the most out the opportunities afforded them. We then move on to talk about the problem of crime and enforcement. Is a highly punitive crackdown on the crime the best way to combat rising crime? Matt doesn’t think it’s that simple. We know that incarceration is linked to the break-up of traditional family structures, but is it really the primary cause? Matt introduces us to Darryl Smith, a remarkable man who did time in prison but came out and turned his life around while helping out his neighbors in Englewood and staging nonviolent protests that resulted in construction unions opening their ranks to local black laborers. We end the discussion by taking a broad view of the South Side’s decline and talking about what can be done to reverse the damage. This is a subject near and dear to my heart, and one that has broader significance to other troubled communities across the country. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Matt’s new book, What Next, Chicago?: Notes of a Pissed-Off Native Son 8:48 Piecing together the puzzle of race, crime, and corruption 18:53 Some Chicago success stories 23:19 Matt: Charter schools are a necessity in Chicago 34:16 Chicago’s thriving Latino communities 40:35 Is increased enforcement the best way to solve Chicago’s crime problem? 54:08 What is disrupting traditional family structures in Chicago’s black communities? 59:02 Darryl Smith, the (unofficial) Mayor of Englewood 1:03:43 The decline of the South Side and the efforts to revive it 1:14:42 So, what’s next for Chicago?Links and ReadingsMatt’s book, What’s Next, Chicago?: Notes of a Pissed-Off Native SonCorey Brooks’s Project H.O.O.D.University of Chicago’s Crime LabNorthwestern University sociologist Andrew PapachristosJane Jacobs’s classic book, The Death and Life of Great American Cities This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John McWhorter is back, just like you knew he would be. This week we’re talking about the future of affirmative action.We begin by discussing Steven Spielberg and Tony Kushner’s new film adaptation of the classic musical West Side Story. John argues that people who dismiss the musical as just “something some old white people wrote” are far too simplistic and limited in their view. I haven’t yet gotten a chance to see the new adaptation, but I’m a fan of the music and lyrics, so I’m inclined to agree with him. We then move on to affirmative action. When the Supreme Court takes up the Harvard admissions case next term, there’s a good chance they’ll end up declaring affirmative action unconstitutional. If that happens, John and I agree that we’ll likely see fewer black students admitted to elite universities, though I think administrators unwilling to scale back their focus on diversity will find ways to admit black students who may not be academically on-par with their peers. John and I are deeply concerned that orienting academic standards—from undergrad admissions to the hiring and tenure process—around diversity and identity will have disastrous consequences for the university system, for the long-term health of the nation, and, yes, for black people. As an object lesson, John presents a (rigorously anonymized!) account of a star black academic who, in John’s account, derives their profile more from their ability to represent their race than their scholarly achievements. Is this person respected by their colleagues for the quality of their work? More worrying, will people simply assume that all black students, academics, and professionals—even those who are truly accomplished—achieve their status due to their race? John worries that people will condescend to his young daughters in that way. If I had young children, I’d worry, too. Things get a little heavy this time out, but that’s because the issues themselves are heavy. I want to know your thoughts—tell me about them in the comments. Correction: In the video, I say that Lisa Cook studied under Paul Romer at Berkeley. This is an error. She was David Romer’s student. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 John: Don’t dismiss West Side Story just because it was written by “old white people” 14:59 If the Supreme Court strikes down affirmative action, will higher education “resegregate”? 24:34 Are meritocracy and racial diversity initiatives inherently opposed to each other? 35:41 What, if anything, are we losing when we give significant weight to racial preference? 47:19 John: Certain black academics are valued for the way they represent their race rather than their scholarly achievements 56:54 The perils of the DEI industry Links and ReadingsJohn’s NYT piece, “Yes, Some Musicals Are Unwoke. That’s Not a Writ to Rewrite Them.”John’s NYT piece, “The Gilded Age’ Is Depicting Black Success. More TV Should.”Heather Mac Donald’s City Journal piece, “March of the Revisionists” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

As many of you know, I’m in the midst of writing a memoir. I’m now calling it The Enemy Within, but its earlier title was Changing My Mind, an allusion both to my intellectual development and to my shifting political orientations. In the course of thinking through my past, I’ve wondered how much the new, more conservative Glenn would have to say to the more liberal Glenn of the ‘90s and ‘00s. So I decided to stage a little “debate” between us. Mark Sussman, my editor here at the newsletter, went through a lecture I delivered at Baruch College in 2000 where I laid out the argument that would become The Anatomy of Racial Inequality. He picked a few clips emblematic of the Old Glenn’s positions, where he thought there might be room for some interesting agreement and disagreement (you can watch the whole lecture here). We then recorded my reactions, with Mark “moderating” between me and my prior self. It turns out that the Old Glenn and the New Glenn agree about a lot of things (though not, of course, everything). If present-day progressives approached problems of racial inequality in the way I recommended then, I still might not sign onto their program today, but there would be much more shared ground where compromise between opposing sides could be reached. Certainly the Old and New Glenns agree about a great deal. It all makes me wonder: Is it too late to abandon the hectoring tone of racial discourse today and have a serious discussion about history, outcomes, and incentives? Despite my own pessimism, I have to hope that it isn’t, and that, at the very least, the Old Glenn still has some allies out there. This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

On this week’s show, I’m talking to the political scientist Steven Rhoads, author of the influential book The Economist’s View of the World, which was recently reissued in a substantially updated edition. Steven thinks the fundamental principles of economics can help even non-economists see the world in a more rational and solution-oriented way, and I have to say, I agree!I begin by asking Steven how a political scientist came to write a book extolling the virtues of economics—why not write one about his own discipline? After all, economists are constantly saying unpopular things that can sound a little heartless (at least if you don’t understand the reasoning). Steven explains what attracts him to economics. We get into the concept where all modern economics begins: the market. Steven asks, if, as some people suppose, only right-wing ideologues champion the efficiency of markets, why do left-wing economists like Paul Krugman and Joseph Stiglitz praise them (with qualifications)? We then approach three ideas fundamental to the study of economics: opportunity costs, incentives, and marginalism. We approach these ideas through practical problems, like why it’s sometimes necessary to make roads and public spaces less safe. (Hint: It’s not because economists are walking calculators devoid of human feeling!) We end the conversation by talking through some pressing questions where economists really should be listened to. Is it a good idea to pay out unemployment benefits to individuals indefinitely? Is it rational to rely on nuclear power when we know the dangers of radiation and nuclear catastrophes? Should individuals be able to undergo as many medical tests and procedures as they want? And, finally, are we overcounting the number of deaths caused by COVID? If you’re wondering how to start thinking like an economist, Steven’s book and this conversation are great places to start. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Steven’s recently reissued and updated book, The Economist’s View of the World: And the Quest for Well-Being 5:28 Why is Steven, a political scientist, interested in how economists think?9:41 The virtue of markets 17:24 Opportunity costs explained 27:07 If everyone needs water and almost no one needs diamonds, why are diamonds more expensive than water? 35:10 Prices, incentives, and compensation 45:43 Would unlimited unemployment benefits help or harm unemployed people? 50:47 Is it rational to expand our reliance on nuclear power? 52:58 The difficulty of reducing healthcare costs 56:58 COVID’s opportunity costsLinks and ReadingsSteven’s book, The Economist’s View of the World: And the Quest for Well-Being This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

I’m back with my friend John McWhorter for one of our regular conversations. A lot has happened on the race and politics front over the last two weeks, so we’ve got a full docket of topics to discuss.And speaking of dockets, after overcoming some technical difficulties, we spend a good chunk of time on matters relating to the Supreme Court. Ilya Shapiro, the incoming director of Georgetown University’s Center for the Constitution, was put on leave by the school after tweeting criticism of Joe Biden for passing over his preferred candidate for the Supreme Court in favor of a “lesser black woman.” Shapiro refers to Biden’s promise to nominate a black woman to fill Justice Stephen Breyer’s seat on the Supreme Court when he retires later this year. Was Shapiro’s tweet racist? Neither John nor I think so, though it was poorly phrased. We go back and forth over the how much representation should play into the composition of the Supreme Court. We’re talking about an extremely elite institution with very few people on it, so I don’t think proportional representation is possible or necessarily even desirable, but it’s a complex matter. I say if Biden had simply nominated a black woman instead of announcing he was going to do so ahead of time, this wouldn’t even be an issue. How much do ordinary black people care about representation on the Supreme Court, anyway? The nomination of Clarence Thomas is an instructive case. We then move on to discuss Whoopi Goldberg’s unfortunate comment about race and the Holocaust. Was she mistaken to say that Nazi persecution of the Jews had nothing to do with race? Absolutely. Do John and I think she should be pilloried for saying it? No. It’s a case of ignorance, not antisemitism. She apologized, and she should be allowed to get on with her life and career. The Joe Rogan affair is next. A montage of the comic and podcast host using “the n-word” several times over the years went viral last week. John raises the point that he wasn’t directing the word at anybody, he was citing it. There’s a difference between hurling a racial slur at someone and uttering a racial slur in order to discuss it. The word itself should not be off limits for the purposes of discussion, and we both think that anyone who simply can’t bear to hear it in any context needs to grow up. As you can see, we take our role as “The Black Guys” seriously in this one. Let us know what you think!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Ilya Shapiro’s controversial tweet about Biden’s imminent Supreme Court nomination 6:03 John dips out and Glenn delivers a soliloquy13:22 John returns and clarifies his academic resume 17:40 Why John thinks that Georgetown shouldn’t fire Ilya Shapiro 23:07 Why should race be a factor in Biden’s Supreme Court pick? 33:43 Should Biden have announced the gender and race of his pick ahead of time? 40:55 John: “There’s real ideological diversity in the black community” 47:34 How bad was Whoopi Goldberg’s statement about the Holocaust? 55:07 Glenn and John agree that Joe Rogan’s use of the n-word is not cause for cancelation Links and ReadingsJohn’s NYT piece, “Don’t Assume Ilya Shapiro’s ‘Lesser Black Woman’ Tweet Was Racist”John’s NYT piece, “It’s Time to End Race-Based Affirmative Action”John’s NYT piece, “End Affirmative Action for Rich White Students, Too”Glenn’s audio essay, “The Call of the Tribe”John’s book, Woke Racism: How a New Religion Has Betrayed Black AmericaDahlia Lithwick and Mark Joseph Stern, “The Nasty Double Standards That Make This SCOTUS Nomination So Toxic”James Scott’s book, Weapons of the Weak: Everyday Forms of Peasant Resistance This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Here at The Glenn Show, I’m taking a little break from politics and culture to talk dollars and cents. My good friend and former Boston University colleague Larry Kotlikoff is here to discuss his new book, Money Magic: An Economist’s Secrets to More Money, Less Risk, and a Better Life. In it, Larry brings his knowledge and expertise as an economist to bear on the everyday problems of spending, saving, and investing. In this episode, he shares some of that advice with TGS viewers.But, wait a minute. Larry is a serious academic economist. Why did he write an advice book? He explains what he’s trying to accomplish with Money Magic. Larry talks about why investing in stocks may not be the best use of your money even when the market is up (especially if you’re carrying debt). I ask Larry about some of my own recent experiences managing my money, and he breaks things down in a way that non-economists can understand. For example, he says, if someone (including the U.S. government) is trying to sell you on a financial product that seems really, really complicated, it’s probably a swindle. What about major life decisions, like divorce? Even then, Larry says, you’re better off balancing the costs and benefits than making a decision without considering the financial consequences. We then get into education. Millions of people in this country carry unmanageable loads of student debt. But Larry thinks you can get an elite education without going into debt at all, and he explains how. Why does the federal government issue student loans, anyway? And is there a more equitable way it could arrange for repayment? Finally, Larry and I get into our personal history and talk about what makes successful individuals the way they are. Whether you’ve got pressing financial questions or not, you’ll want to hear what Larry has to say. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Larry’s new book, Money Magic: An Economist’s Secrets to More Money, Less Risk, and a Better Life 4:36 Why did Larry, a serious academic economist, write a financial advice book? 14:23 Why investing in stocks may not be as safe as it seems in the long term 24:17 Larry: If a personal finance product is complicated, it’s a swindle 29:34 An economist’s guide to divorce 32:48 Is a free online Stanford education more valuable than a debt-laden traditional degree? 44:20 Why does the government offer student loans? 51:12 Larry: “We’re all self-made people at some level”Links and ReadingsLarry’s new book, Money Magic: An Economist’s Secrets to More Money, Less Risk, and a Better LifeGlenn’s classic 1981 paper, “Intergenerational Transfers and the Distribution of Earnings” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John McWhorter and I often find ourselves aligned on the issues we discuss on The Glenn Show. We’ve even received criticism for how much we agree with each other! This episode should please those critics, as John and I actually find ourselves in stark (though productive and friendly) disagreement on a few matters. Let’s get into it. We begin by talking about Joe Biden’s recent press conference. Personally, I think he performed pretty badly, as the White House subsequently had to walk back several of his statements. Are these just more of Biden’s characteristic gaffes, or do his misstatements reflect a deeper confusion within the administration? What values does Biden’s presidency represent, anyway? We go on to discuss voting rights and election legislation. We disagree about proposed changes to state-level voting laws: John thinks they're racist in their intent, and I remain to be convinced of that. We also disagree about the meaning of their effects. I have no problem with voter ID requirements, tightening the enforcement of existing laws, and other reasonable ballot security measures. But John is wary. He seems to be concerned that Republicans’ voting security measures are veiled attempts to increase their relative share of the turnout in certain contested districts by decreasing the participation in elections of (reliably Democratic) black voters. Why, he wonders, has ballot security become such an issue now? Of course, I have my responses! I then ask John what he thinks about New York City Mayor Eric Adams’s performance in his first weeks on the job. John was quite critical of Adams last time we talked, but he’s changed his mind. Finally, we get into the Amy Wax issue. Her recent TGS appearance and its aftermath lead us to discuss crucial questions about speech, platforming, and teaching. My fellow John Stuart Mill fans will want to pay close attention to this section.This is a rich exchange that I’m sure will provoke much commentary, so please do weigh in. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 What political values does Joe Biden represent? 8:53 Do new election laws amount to race-based voter disenfranchisement? 23:00 Glenn: Black people are free. But what should we do with that freedom? 36:06 John changes his mind about Eric Adams 42:21 John addresses linguistic informality and Sidney Poitier in his recent columns 44:28 Amy Wax: heterodox thinker, provocateur, or racist?Links and ReadingsBill Maher, “New Rule: First Lady Barack Obama” John’s NYT piece, “Don’t, Like, Overanalyze Language”John’s NYT piece, “On Sidney Poitier, Code Switching and the Black Voice”Amy Wax’s Race, Wrongs, and Remedies: Group Justice in the 21st Century This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week we’ve got Heather Mac Donald on The Glenn Show. Heather is a fellow of the Manhattan Institute, a contributing editor to City Journal, and author of several books, including The Diversity Delusion, The War on Cops, and The Burden of Bad Ideas. Heather’s writing combines meticulous research and sharp, uncompromising prose. Her positions on crime and policing have led some on the left to regard her as a bit of a boogeyman. But while she is a fierce critic of failing progressive policies, she’s also a deep and surprising thinker, as you’ll see here. We begin by exploring Heather’s recent readings in African American literature, and her reflections on the behavior of white people in this country through the mid-twentieth century. We then move into one of Heather’s area of expertise: crime and policing in American cities. She points out that those who blame rising violent crime rates on the Covid pandemic are neglecting data from other countries. The virus hit Peru, for example, much worse than it hit us, but they saw their violent crime rates drop. Why? Heather goes on to ask, if progressive activists, politicians, and media figures are so concerned with “black lives,” why do we see so little coverage of black children harmed or even killed by violent crime? You can be sure we’d hear about it if they were white. We then get into the difficult matter of family structure in black communities. Out-of-wedlock births and fatherless households are often extremely detrimental to child development. These phenomena are particularly pronounced in black communities, but they’re a problem everywhere. In fact, it’s such a problem that it seems like virtually no one has the moral authority to try to fix it. We go on to discuss the civilizational threat posed by the dissolution of academic and professional standards, the lack of responsible black leadership in the U.S., and the oft-forgotten fact that the loudest advocates for harsh drug penalties during the crack epidemic were black leaders and voters.Hope you enjoy!Note: When we discuss the work of my friend Alice Goffman, I mistakenly say that she attended graduate school at the University of Wisconsin. She actually went to Princeton. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Heather’s deep dive into African American literature 14:23 The impact of George Floyd on violent crime rates 22:26 Heather: Why doesn’t the mainstream media cover the violent deaths of black children? 28:07 The difficulty of addressing black out-of-wedlock birth rates 39:44 Who has the moral authority to advocate for traditional family structures? 46:17 Heather: Giuliani was one of America’s greatest mayors 51:39 Glenn: Lowering academic standards threatens the foundation of our civilization 1:00:21 Looking for black leadership 1:08:54 Was the reaction to the crack epidemic a “moral panic”?Links and ReadingsVideo of Glenn’s National Conservatism Convention keynote, “The Case for Black Patriotism” The text of “The Case for Black Patriotism” in First ThingsGene Dattle’s Reckoning with Race: America’s FailureFrederick Douglass’s 1852 speech, “What to the Slave Is the Fourth of July?”Alice Goffman’s On the Run: Fugitive Life in America This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John McWhorter is back for our first conversation of 2022. Let’s get into it!We begin by discussing the death of the groundbreaking black actor Sidney Poitier. Portier was best known for his roles in films like The Defiant Ones, Lilies of the Field, In the Heat of the Night, and Guess Who’s Coming to Dinner. John puts forward the fascinating theory that Poitier’s Caribbean origins and mannerisms made him acceptable to white American audiences who were unaccustomed to seeing black men in dramatic leading roles. We also recently lost the legal scholar Lani Guinier, who was involved in a political controversy in the ‘90s when Bill Clinton nominated her for Assistant Attorney General for Civil Rights and then pulled the nomination after receiving political pressure from the right. Though Lani and I were on different ends of the political spectrum, she was an important legal thinker, and I think what happened to her was terribly unfair. Of course, while her views were controversial then, John and I note that they’re widely accepted now. We then go on to discuss a question it hadn’t previously occurred to me to ask: Why don’t we see more women in the ranks of heterodox black public intellectuals? (If you know of some I’m forgetting, let me know in the comments!) We then turn to the anniversary of the January 6 riot. John and I agree that it didn’t rise to the level of an “attempted coup” or an “insurrection,” but it doesn’t bode well for the stability of our elections or the country itself. Are we going to see more violence of this kind in future elections? And finally, John we do a quick review of some of John’s prodigious recent output for the New York Times and his podcast, Lexicon Valley. It’s great to be back with John after a month-long hiatus. Let us know what you think of the conversation!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 The significance of Sidney Poitier’s Caribbean origins  9:27 Revisiting the Lani Guinier controversy  24:09 How Guinier’s views eventually triumphed 29:50 Where are the “heterodox” black women?  38:36 Glenn: I’m worried about the stability of our electoral process 49:12 Are we on the precipice of violent political conflict? 1:01:04 An update on John’s prodigious outputLinks and Readings“They call me Mr. Tibbs.”Susan Sturm and Lani Guinier, “The Future of Affirmative Action: Reclaiming the Innovative Ideal”Abigail Thernstrom, Whose Votes Count?: Affirmative Action and Minority Voting RightsCarol Swain, Black Faces, Black Interests: The Representation of African Americans in CongressDavid Brooks’s NYT column, “Why Democrats Are So Bad at Defending Democracy” John’s NYT newsletter post, “I Can’t Brook the Idea of Banning ‘Negro’”John’s NYT newsletter post, “Stephen Sondheim Wrote My Life’s Soundtrack”John’s NYT newsletter post, “Yes, the Classics Make Us Better People”The new home of John’s language podcast, Lexicon Valley This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week I’m honored to have the distinguished Robert Woodson on the show. Since joining the civil rights movement as an activist and organizer in the ‘60s, Bob has dedicated himself to finding solutions to the problems of poverty and dysfunction in America. Through the Woodson Center, Bob helps fund and advise programs that are on the ground and working to solve some of the toughest problems in American communities. He’s got more awards and achievements than I can possibly list here, and there’s no telling how many lives he’s changed over the years. In this conversation, Bob and I talk about some of the problems with large-scale anti-poverty funding. Bob argues that, while big programs and studies may have their hearts in the right place, they are plagued by inefficiency and often vulnerable to misappropriation. Moreover, welfare programs can introduce perverse incentives into vulnerable communities, creating cycles of dependency that prevent recipients from achieving self-sufficiency. Bob emphasizes the importance of working with people from within those communities, especially those who use faith as a starting point for practical reform. I ask Bob how local programs like this can scale up, especially when they’re religious in nature, and he points to a heartening example in Philadelphia. Bob then takes us through some of the programs the Woodson Center is partnered with and describes the phenomenal work they do. Finally, I announce in public something that has been in the works for a while here at TGS. Starting this year, 10 percent of The Glenn Show’s net earnings will be donated to the Woodson Center to help fund programs of the kind Bob describes. I’ll also periodically have some of the people behind those programs on as guests to talk about their work. I’m grateful for all of the success I’m having here, and it feels right to pay it forward.This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Bob: “There is no monolithic ‘Black Community’”8:27 How much anti-poverty spending actually goes to poor people? 19:35 Recalibrating welfare’s perverse incentives 25:15 Can community faith-based interventions scale up? 34:37 The moral inconsistencies of progressive policy 42:24 What should we focus on instead of race? 46:54 How the Woodson Center is working to restore communities 1:01:59 Why is there no religious dimension to current racial justice movements? 1:05:00 The Glenn Show gives backLinks and ReadingsThe Woodson CenterThe Piney Woods SchoolVoices of Black Mothers UnitedVBMU’s Sylvia Bennett-Stone on The Glenn ShowProject H.O.O.D.Hope for Prisoners This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

It’s been a big year here at The Glenn Show. So as 2021 draws to a close, I thought it would be a nice idea to round up some choice selections from the conversations I’ve had with John over the past year. This episode is a kind of “best of” compilation of segments that got a big response from viewers or that I personally thought were important or noteworthy. I couldn’t include all of the highlights, but I think these clips give a good sense of what my conversations with John were all about in 2021.I must also offer my thanks and gratitude to everyone who read, listened, watched, and commented this year, and especially to those of you who continue to support TGS by subscribing to this newsletter. We wouldn’t be able to do it without you. So from the bottom of my heart, thank you!I’m sure I left out things that regular viewers think were worthy of inclusion. What were some of the segments that resonated with you over the last year? What caused you to think, changed your mind, or made you laugh? Post ‘em in the comments!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 A special “thank you” from Glenn 6:23 Race and classics (June 18)18:20 Maintaining domestic tranquility in the face of political differences (March 22)36:06 The “badass motherfucker” problem (April 19)46:31 An “aria” on free will and community (July 2)51:04 Responding to “Simone” (November 19)56:18 Glenn: “I was wrong” about Trump (January 22)1:09:37 Reflections on Obama's legacy (October 1)1:18:32 Finding hope amidst wokeness (November 19) This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

On this week’s show, I talk with Professor Amy Wax of the University of Pennsylvania Law School. As you might have guessed, we get into some very controversial territory. But that’s why I enjoy talking to Amy—she doesn’t pull her punches.Amy begins by talking about her position at Penn Law, where a group of alumni are attempting to get her fired. It’s not the first time people have tried this—as Amy notes, she’s been “canceled” many times, but she’s still here. We move on to a discussion of immigration. While I think the U.S. has benefitted from the talent and value of non-Western immigrants and will require more of them in the future if we’re going to compete, Amy is more skeptical. She wonders whether immigrants from South Asia and East Asia have democratic sensibilities that are compatible with American culture. She worries, too, that these immigrants will adopt woke political positions. But is it necessary to look abroad for a supply of talented, technically minded people? Why can’t we find them here? Amy and I both think that would be a good idea. Amy asks me how conservatives should deal with the problem of wokeness. I tell her that we have to fight these battles as they come. We spend the last third of our conversation talking about the extremely contentious issues of white identity, European history, and colonialism. It wouldn’t be a conversation with Amy Wax if we didn’t push every possible hot button. I’m very curious to know what you all think of the conversation. Let me know in the comments!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Want to give the gift of The Glenn Show this holiday season? Click below to purchase a subscription for a friend or loved one. 0:00 The latest attempt to get Amy fired from Penn Law 5:41 Should we be worried even about elite non-Western immigration? 19:21 Amy: “There’s nothing wrong with stereotyping” when it’s done correctly 26:28 Glenn: America need immigrants if we’re going to compete 34:23 Why aren’t we looking harder for technical talent in America? 40:09 The problem with “equal representation” 47:15 Glenn: Wokeness is a political problem that must be fought politically 59:38 The collective action problem of “commonsense” race politics 1:02:36 Is Charles Murray right to worry about white identity politics? 1:18:12 Glenn: “We need to abandon the identitarian matrix altogether” 1:26:37 Was European colonialism especially bad or an expression of broader human tendencies?Links and ReadingsGlenn’s 2021 National Conservatism Conference speech, “The Case for Black Patriotism” in First Things.A transcript of Amy’s 2019 National Conservatism Conference speechMatt Taibbi, “The Red-Pilling of Loudoun County, Virginia”Yuval Levin, “The Changing Face of Social Breakdown”Michael Anton, “Unprecedented” Adam Hochschild, King Leopold’s Ghosts: A Story of Greed, Terror, and Heroism in Colonial Africa This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The “common sense” of the Woke Left sees so many issues, from the historical effects of redlining to the relationship between race and IQ, as matters that no longer require discussion. “Redlining is responsible for present-day racial wealth disparities, period. There is no relationship between race and IQ, period. End of discussion.”But the discussion is not over, these matters and many others are not settled. Treating them as such just papers over matters of vital concern that require serious thinking. John and I have in some sense made it our mission to unsettle these so-called settled questions. And in the course of doing it, we’ve unsettled the people that consider the questions settled as well. We talk a bit about in this week’s conversation.I begin by talking to John about reaching what may be the current high-water mark of his fame: He was a clue on a recent episode of Jeopardy. There are perhaps more data-driven ways of understanding how fame works, but if the writers on Jeopardy know who you are, you must be exerting some kind of influence on the culture. We then move on to discuss attempts by activists to change math curricula in order to (these activists claims) make them more accommodating to black students. Some argue that these changes don’t alter the fundamental character of math education, but John strongly disagrees. Which is not to say that considerations of diversity have no place in the sciences. Graduate programs in technical fields could take more risks in who they admit to their programs without lowering their overall standards. Doing so might net them the next Roland Fryer (or even the next Glenn Loury). We then return to the small screen. John talks about going on The View to promote Woke Racism, and I talk about debating Michael Eric Dyson on Bill Maher’s Real Time. With the Jussie Smollett verdict in, we reflect on the bizarre story the Empire actor tried to sell and his maybe even more bizarre refusal to admit he lied. We then go on to discuss America’s “black-white” racial binary. With so many people of so many different backgrounds, ethnicities, and colors now populating the country, does this mindset still make sense? And finally, we ask why cultural explanations for racial disparities are still taboo for so many people.As always, this was a stimulating, deep, and fun conversation with my good friend. I hope you enjoy it! This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Want to give the gift of The Glenn Show this holiday season? Click below to purchase a subscription for a friend or loved one. 0:00 This regular TGS guest was recently a clue on Jeopardy 2:23 Is race-conscious math education as radical as it sounds? 14:17 Why diversity, when done right, can be an asset 19:55 John on The View, Glenn on Bill Maher 26:34 The strange case of Jussie Smollett 43:42 Does the American “white-black” binary make sense anymore? 49:39 If America is irredeemably racist, why do so many non-white people immigrate here? 58:18 What’s the matter with “culture”?Links and ReadingsJohn’s appearance on Nathan Robinson’s podcast Stephon Alexander’s Fear of a Black Universe: An Outsider’s Guide to the Future of PhysicsDavid Austen-Smith and Roland Fryer, “An Economic Analysis of ‘Acting White’”Andrew Sullivan, “The Woke: On the Wrong Side of History”Matt Taibbi, “The Red-Pilling of Loudon County, Virginia” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The audiovisual experiments continue here at The Glenn Show. In some of our recent conversations, John McWhorter and I talked about how we would reply to “Simone,” a fictionalized version of one of my students at Brown who believes that systemic racism causes most or all of the racial disparities in the US. I think Simone is wrong about that, but this idea is so widespread that John and I agreed that we can’t just brush it aside. We need to address and refute it head on. We attempted to do that in this conversation. And I think we did a pretty good job! But in a comment, a reader, Adam, pointed out that we neglected to anticipate some very strong arguments that Simone might have made in her own defense. I replied to Adam, but I think our exchange deserves a more prominent place, so I recorded an audio version and Nikita Petrov created some visuals to go along with it. We’re looking to produce more content like this in the future, but we’d love your input. Let me know what you think in the comments!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Want to give the gift of The Glenn Show this holiday season? Click below to purchase a subscription for a friend or loved one. This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week on TGS we’ve got Rav Arora. He’s a compelling writer on race matters in the US. He’s also a college undergraduate, though it would be a mistake to underestimate him. He’s already published in a number of widely read outlets, including the New York Post, Quillette, and City Journal. He’s also got a Substack called Noble Truths, where he writes about psychedelics, meditation, and cultural trends. I begin by inquiring into Rav’s intellectual background. What is this young guy from Canada doing writing about race and crime in the US, anyway? Rav talks about how the summer of 2020 led him to rethink his views and begin writing about them for the public. Rav is quite critical of the way that race, crime, and policing are covered in the US media, but he’s got a nuanced view of things. He talks about why he thinks we need police reform and also more police on the streets. We then move on to a discussion of systemic racism. I say it’s not inconceivable that a police department with a disproportionately high number of black officers could perpetuate racial inequality, though Rav doesn’t seem quite convinced that’s the case. From there, we discuss the misguided claim that violent crime in some black communities is driven solely by poverty. When the question of genetic factors in crime rates comes up, I don’t demure. I don’t know whether there actually is a genetic component, but I’m not ready to dismiss it out of hand. And we round out the discussion by touching on alternatives to incarceration, the increasing earning power of Asian American women, and the recent historic rise in US homicide rates. Rav and I covered a lot of ground in this one. He’s a vital new voice, one I’ll be paying close attention to—I hope you will, too. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Want to give the gift of The Glenn Show this holiday season? Click below to purchase a subscription for a friend or loved one. 0:00 How Rav got his start on the crime, policing, and identity politics beat 10:33 Why is a Canadian college student writing about race and crime in the US? 21:30 Rav: We need police reform but also more police in black communities 31:34 Will hiring more black police officers make police departments “less racist”? 43:26 Glenn: It’s ridiculous to say that violent crime is driven only by poverty 50:04 Is it possible that racial disparities in crime rates have a genetic basis? 55:09 Are there any effective alternatives to prison? 1:00:52 Why Asian American women are out-earning white men 1:10:23 What’s behind the historic rise in homicide rates?Rav’s Substack, Noble TruthsAldon Morris’s Scientific American essay, “From Civil Rights to Black Lives Matter”Rav’s Quillette piece, “A Peculiar Kind of Racist Patriarchy”  Urban Labs’ Becoming a Man program David Frum’s 2016 interview with Barry Latzer about crime wavesLast year’s famous study of the “Minneapolis effect”The Marshall Project’s analysis of race and victimization in 2020 This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John and I often talk about how we feel about race in America, but we rarely delve into why we feel the way we feel. What factors in our own lives primed us for those emotional responses? While John and I often agree about where the politics of race have gone wrong, we just as often experience very different feelings about these matters.I start the discussion off by raising a question a friend put to me recently: are we wasting our time engaging with “red meat” issues in the race debate? Should we stick to the hard data before wading into the culture war? This leads us to discuss our very different emotional responses to the people we disagree with. I tend to go to anger and John tends toward empathy. We look to our respective pasts to try to understand why we diverge in this way. In fact, we stay in the past for a while, looking back on our exposure to Afrocentrism and black radicalism in our youths and to the skepticism that often attended those encounters. Finally, we work our way back around to “Omar.” Personally, I believe that the Omars of the world can and must lay claim to their agency. That they often refuse to is source of constant frustration and, yes, shame. It’s an intense episode. It’s also one marred by technical difficulties. John lost his connection at several points during the conversation, and finally what had been a dialogue became a monologue. Apologies for the rough edges!Want to give the gift of The Glenn Show this holiday season? Click below to purchase a subscription for a friend or loved one.0:00 Are Glenn and John wasting their time by talking about race? 10:36 How Glenn and John’s families shaped their attitudes toward race 20:42 Looking back on past radicalism 27:15 Glenn: Is my anger necessary? 33:26 Can “Omar” change his ways? This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

In this week’s TGS, my old friend Larry Kotlikoff, an economist at Boston University, is back to talk about some of our most pressing economic concerns. Chief among them is the inflation rate, which has hit a 30-year high. By some accounts, inflation is now threatening to do major, possibly longterm damage to the US economy. But are things as bad as they seem? Larry will take us through his analysis and talk about some other looming economic troubles. If you want to understand how these things work, Larry is your guy.We begin by discussing just why high inflation poses such a dire threat to the economy. Obviously it’s something to be concerned about, but will it get bad enough to send us the way of Weimar Germany? This leads us to discuss Biden’s recent policy decisions, including the $1.2 trillion infrastructure bill. Larry argues that it’s not as costly as it sounds when you consider that it’s parceled out over the course of a decade. Larry is much more concerned about the fiscal gap, which is enormous and, according to Larry, could eventually lead the US into insolvency. Larry sees this as a problem that can only be solved by responsible political leadership, but we have trouble naming any current politicians with the influence to get it done. It’s always great to have Larry on the show (even if he has a tendency to make some pretty frightening predictions about the future). As always, I’m interested to know what you think!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.Want to give the gift of The Glenn Show this holiday season? Click below to purchase a subscription for a friend or loved one. 0:00 Why high inflation is a potentially dire problem 9:00 Are we headed the way of Weimar Germany and Argentina? 20:37 How short-term government spending can function as a longterm investment 30:02 The looming threat of the fiscal gap 37:08 Why is the US’s fiscal gap so large compared to that of other countries? 41:30 Larry: We’re on the path to becoming a second-rate country 46:37 Why Larry thinks we should index taxes to inflation 53:36 Can we pay for what we’re spending without printing money?Links and ReadingsSteven Rattner’s NYT guest essay, “I Warned the Democrats about Inflation”Larry Summers’s WaPo op-ed, “On inflation, it’s past time for team transitory to stand down”Larry’s website This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

A couple weeks ago in this space, I published an autobiographical sketch called “The Double Life.” It elicited such a strong reaction from readers that I wanted to revisit it, so I recorded an audio version and Nikita Petrov, my creative director, created a video feature to go along with it. I plan to do more of these audio/video pieces in the future, mostly for subscribers. Let me know what you think of this new feature in the comments!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, ad-free versions of the podcast, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below. This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week, John and I continue our discussion of systemic racism, which was kicked off when one of my students wrote a searing critique of some of my positions. John and I agreed that “Simone” (not her real name) deserved a real, intellectually serious response. We can’t just blow off Simone and people like her—that is, sober-minded, sincere, intelligent progressives and leftists who happen to think that systemic racism is responsible for all or most of America’s racial disparities. In responding to their critiques, we hope to persuade them that there are more accurate ways to describe the situation. The first part of this attempt came by way of our conversation with Randy Kennedy. This is the second entry. In our next conversation, John and I hope to move from outlining the problems to proposing some solutions.This conversation kicks off with the revelation that demand for John has outstripped supply—he simply doesn’t have time to talk about his book Woke Racism on podcasts anymore. We then set the table a bit and outline our broad critique of theories of systemic racism. We talk about whether it still makes sense to attribute racial disparities to black people’s status as victims of perpetual injustice. Are we really victims? Or has that story gotten old? We then move on the racial wealth gap, where we debunk claims about redlining and discuss why comparing the median incomes of whites and blacks makes no sense if you want to see what’s important about wealth disparities. We then move on to a slightly trickier subject: crack and powder cocaine sentencing disparities and incarceration. This is an area where I really do think there’s probably something to accusations of systemic racism, though that is not the only issue at play. John wants to know whether academic historical analyses of systemic racism can offer any counsel to ordinary people today. We end the discussion proper on the question of a racist white backlash against the excesses of woke politics.I think many of you will find this one quite satisfying. I’m interested to hear what you think!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 John takes a step back from podcasting 3:29 Confronting the critique of systemic racism 14:18 The persistence of victimhood 19:36 Accounting for the racial wealth gap 31:50 Glenn: When it comes to incarceration, we have to take systemic racism seriously 46:29 Can analyses of historical systemic racism offer us counsel today? 51:52 John: Certain members of "the Elect" would be pleased to see an alt-right backlashLinks and ReadingsMatthew Desmond’s piece on plantation slavery from the 1619 ProjectMichael Fortner’s book, The Black Silent Majority: The Rockefeller Drug Laws and the Politics of PunishmentJames Forman, Jr.’s book, Locking Up Our Own: Crime and Punishment in Black America This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Recently, I was asked to deliver a speech at the National Conservatism Conference, which was held in Orlando, Florida. It was high-profile affair with many prominent conservative intellectuals, media figures, and politicians speaking and in attendance. And I don’t mind saying I had a prime speaking slot! I used the speech to develop some ideas I’ve aired here on TGS, and I think many of you will be gratified by the reaction they get from the crowd. But make no mistake: I’m not just telling them what they want to hear. In the speech, I try to make the case for black patriotism, the forthright embrace of American nationalism by black people. I argue that, ultimately, most black people want the same things as most other Americans: safety, a shot at improvement, a fair and just government, and personal freedom. Black people share a common culture with the rest of the country—emphasizing racial difference obscures that essential fact. I also argue that conservatives need to go beyond making generic, color-blind claims about America and leaving it at that. Racial inequality is real, and there do need to be initiatives put it place to remedy it. I then go on to outline some “unspeakable truths” about race pertaining to four topics: racial disparity, the racialization of police violence, the threat of white backlash, and American equality. I end by engaging with Frederick Douglass, who gave a famous address about slavery and the Fourth of July. The Fourth is, indeed, “ours”—all of ours. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 “Tolstoy is mine. Dickens is mine. Newton, Maxwell, and Einstein are mine” 4:13 “Our Americanness is much more important than our blackness” 7:39 Conservatives cannot go back to "business as usual" on race9:22 A conservative prescription for persistent racial inequality 11:38 The roots of racial disparity 17:17 Putting police killings of black Americans into perspective 23:58 From white guilt to white backlash 28:10 The “lie” that the American Dream doesn’t apply to blacks 34:47 Black people “must seize equal status” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week’s TGS features two incomparable guests: John McWhorter and Randall Kennedy. John, of course, needs no introduction. Randy is a professor at Harvard Law School and the author of many books, the latest of which is Say It Loud!: On Race, Law, History, and Culture. In this episode, we get into it pretty much immediately. Randy admits to being “thrown” by Donald Trump’s election and to finding his campaign openly racist. I, as you may know, think that is an oversimplified explanation of Trump’s appeal in 2016. We go on to discuss how a certain amount of racism will be with us for the foreseeable future, and we’ll just have to deal with it. Given that the situation will never be perfect, what would constitute an “acceptable” level of racism? We then go on to discuss two of the “big issues”: Policing and affirmative action. There’s a lot of intensity in this conversation, and I’m excited for you to hear it!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, an ad-free podcast feed, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Randy: “I feel torn and, frankly, bewildered” about the state of race in the US 7:17 Can we blame Trump for the tenor of racial discourse today? 17:27 Crediting the achievements of black Americans after Emancipation 25:46 Is the criminal justice system as discriminatory as it appears? 34:55 Glenn: We need to deracialize the conversation about policing 45:54 Taking account of culture in debates about racial inequality 56:49 Affirmative action with an asterisk 1:08:29 Does affirmative action require lowering standards?Links and ReadingsRandy’s new book, Say It Loud!: On Race. Law, History, and CultureW.E.B. Du Bois’s book, The Philadelphia NegroGlenn’s conversation with Wai Wah ChinGlenn’s book, The Anatomy of Racial Inequality This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

I know this week everyone is expecting one of my conversations with John McWhorter. But due to some unforeseen events, we ended up shifting things around a bit. Next week you can expect to see John and I speak with Harvard Law School professor Randall Kennedy, where we’ll engage issues of systemic racism, among other topics. Two weeks after that, John and I will be back to have our own discussion about systemic racism. We said we wanted to formulate serious responses to those who believe systemic racism is still the cause of racial inequality in the US, and you can expect to see that in the coming weeks.For this week’s episode, I’m presenting a recent lecture I gave at Baylor University and the Q&A session that followed. The lecture distills some of my ideas about social capital, the bias narrative and the development narrative, and the problems that beset urban black communities. The students and professors also offered some fantastic questions that provoked me to think about intersectionality and mass incarceration, the language of racial discrimination, and whether my critiques of the bias narrative offer aid and comfort to the enemy. I’m grateful to Baylor for having invited me, and I’m pleased to be able to offer the lecture to you here.Note: If you’re listening to the free audio version of this conversation, you’ll notice that there are now ads. I explain why I’ve started to take on advertisers at the beginning of the episode. If you’d like to continue receiving the podcast without ads, you can subscribe below for access to the ad-free podcast feed, as well as monthly Q&As with John McWhorter and me, early access to TGS episodes, and other subscriber benefits. 0:00 A quick announcement 2:00 “Structural racism is an empty category” 4:35 The bias narrative vs. the development narrative10:43 Race as a social phenomenon 19:10 Racism is not the cause of behavioral problems in black communities 27:41 “White people cannot give black people equality” 32:31 Q&A: How has economic thinking about racism and the market changed? 39:20 Q&A: What strategies will help people engage in modes of development? 43:00 Q&A: What are the prospects for improvements? 48:54 Q&A: How has the language of racial discrimination changed? 53:12 Q&A: Is intersectionality a factor in racial inequality? 1:02:03 Q&A: Do Glenn's claims reinforce white prejudice against blacks? This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

In this week’s TGS, we’re talking about an issue that seems local but has big national implications. Wai Wah Chin is the Charter President of the Chinese American Citizens Alliance of Greater New York, and she joins me to discuss an ongoing controversy in New York City’s exam schools. These schools are rigorous public high schools that focus on STEM subjects, and admission is determined by student performance on a single exam. If you can excel on one test, you can get access to a free first-rate education, regardless of income, race, zip code, or even past academic performance. This is especially important in a city where top private schools often charge tens of thousands of dollars in tuition. Historically, exam schools have been a triumph of colorblind meritocracy. They’ve brought untold numbers of talented but under-resourced students to the attention of top universities. But, as Wai Wah explains, the exam school system is currently under threat from advocates who regard the high numbers of Asian American students (over 50% in some cases) at these schools as evidence of de facto segregation that excludes blacks. Wai Wah explains why proposed changes to the exam school admissions system discriminate against Asians, and why parallel attempts to eliminate the Gifted and Talented Program for New York students will only exacerbate racial disparities in the education system. Finally, Wai Wah connects discrimination against Asians in education to the disturbing increase in violence against Asians across the country.Wai Wah is a passionate advocate for her cause. I can tell you this is not the last time I’ll be discussing these crucial matters on TGS. A New Home for TGSI’ve started a new YouTube channel, and I invite you to subscribe to it (and click the bell button!) now so that you don't miss future offerings. This newsletter will continue to publish as usual with the same benefits for subscribers.This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 What are NYC exam schools? 5:25 The recent attempt to change exam school admissions 11:50 Wai Wah: Changes to exam schools will discriminate against Asian students 17:40 Wai Wah's attempts to expand the Gifted and Talented Program 27:26 Are exam schools "segregated"? 39:29 Eric Adams's support for increasing the number of exam schools 42:00 Wai Wah: Asians are being scapegoatedLinks and ReadingsThe Chinese American Citizens Alliance of Greater New York Dream Factories, a mini-doc about NYC exam schools This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

In this episode of The Glenn Show, I’m back with my friend John McWhorter, and we have much to discuss. John joins me fresh from a day trip to Brighton Beach, a neighborhood in Brooklyn where Russian language, food, and culture abound. He talks about teaching himself Russian and the benefits of the Glossika language-learning tool. Then, in a continuation of last week’s conversation with David Kaiser, we move on to the history of redlining, which is quite a bit more complex than some recent commentaries would have you believe. A recent edition of John’s New York Times newsletter addressed the issue, and it received some criticism from the distinguished historian Thomas Sugrue. This leads us to discuss the problems of authority and perception that attend writing from the Olympian heights of the paper of record. From there, I give a progress report on my memoir, delving into my life, my break from conservatism in the ‘90s, and the difficulty of living in good faith. The temptation to “play to the crowd,” to seek affirmation by repeating the common sense of your tribe, is very powerful, and it can work on you in subtle ways. Heterodox thinkers like John and I have to check ourselves constantly to make sure we’re being true to our own thought and principles. In that spirit, we end on a question that’s sure to ruffle some feathers here at my Substack: How can we start seriously addressing questions about “systemic racism” and stop simply disregarding them as just so much wokespeak? As always, I’m curious to hear your thoughts! A New Home for TGSThe video for this episode is hosted on my new YouTube channel, which is now the home of The Glenn Show. I invite you to subscribe to this channel (and click the bell button!) now so that you don't miss future offerings. This newsletter will continue to publish as usual with the same benefits for subscribers.This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 John's linguistic adventure in Brighton Beach 7:59 The complex racial and economic dynamics of redlining 17:30 The problem with John's NYT “megaphone” 26:40 A progress report on Glenn's memoir 41:29 The temptations of playing to the crowd 46:43 What, if anything, does it mean to be “authentically black”? 51:13 Taking "systemic racism" seriouslyLinks and ReadingsThe language-learning tool GlossikaJohn’s column about GlossikaJohn’s piece about redliningGlenn’s conversation with historian David E. KaiserThomas Sugrue’s Twitter thread about John’s redlining pieceJohn’s book, Authentically Black: Essays for the Black Silent Majority This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

In this episode of The Glenn Show, I’m talking to David E. Kaiser, author of many books about American and international political history. As a distinguished professional historian, David has seen many changes in the way history is written both inside and outside the academy, not all of them for the better. In this conversation, David talks about why Ta-Nehisi Coates’s highly influential 2014 essay “The Case for Reparations” and the view of race and American history it represents leaves out many crucial facts about how we came to be where we are.We begin in a slightly counterintuitive place, with a discussion of how many historians’ views of the Cold War changed after Vietnam. In David’s telling, it became more and more common to see historians placing blame for escalating hostilities on the U.S.’s foreign policy rather than the U.S.S.R.’s. David sees a similar sort of revisionism at work in contemporary historians’ perspectives on the New Deal, which is now sometimes described as a purposefully racially discriminatory enterprise. David pushes back against this interpretation, pointing to the South’s pursuit of industry and cheap labor as a better explanation for the New Deal’s flaws than racial animus. We also discuss statistics indicating that, while blacks did earn significantly less money than whites, the years after World War II saw tremendous economic growth in black communities. And, while redlining policies certainly did have a negative impact on the ability of blacks to acquire wealth, those policies alone only tell part of the black economic story. Finally, David ends our discussion by reading from a fascinating 1940 editorial in the black newspaper the Chicago Defender that endorses FDR for a third term. I truly enjoyed this conversation, and I hope you will as well! A New Home for TGSThe video for this episode is hosted on my own new YouTube channel, which is now the home of The Glenn Show. I invite you to subscribe to this channel (and click the bell button!) now so that you don't miss future offerings. This newsletter will continue to publish as usual with the same benefits for subscribers.0:00 Intro 2:35 The post-Vietnam reevaluation of the Cold War 13:12 David: Academic historians largely have abandoned the idea of objective truth 18:23 Were black people really excluded from the New Deal? 32:06 The fortunes of black veterans after WWII 40:19 Why redlining doesn't tell the whole story about the racial wealth gap 49:49 Why the Chicago Defender endorsed FDR in 1940Links and ReadingsDavid’s memoir, A Life in HistoryDavid’s book, No End Save Victory: How FDR Led the Nation into WarDavid’s book, American Tragedy: Kennedy, Johnson, and the Origins of the Vietnam WarGlenn’s conversation with Daniel Bessner, “American Empire before and after 9/11”Ira Katznelson’s book, When Affirmative Action Was White: An Untold History of Racial Inequality in AmericaTa-Nehisi Coates’s essay, “The Case for Reparations”The Chicago Fed’s paper, “The Effects of the 1930s HOLC ‘Redlining’ Maps”Andrew Fenton’s article, “WTF happened in 1971 (and why the f**k it matters so much right now)” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

For this week’s episode of The Glenn Show, we’ve upped our production game a little. In late August, John McWhorter and I met up for an all-too-rare in-person conversation in Manhattan, and the filmmaker Rob Montz and his crew were on hand to record it. It was wonderful to be able sit face-to-face with John, and Rob did a wonderful job capturing the energy in the room. It wouldn’t have been possible to pull all of this together without the support of the subscribers here: Thank you! We’re hoping to create more special content like this in the future, so your contributions are greatly appreciated. John and I begin by discussing his gig writing for the New York Times, in particular a recent piece about Harold Arlen and Johnny Mercer’s Blues Opera. It’s never been produced, and John is assisting in trying to usher it to the stage. We move from the blues to matters that are just plain blue: The word “motherfucker,” which began as black vernacular and has since been absorbed into the English language at large. This naturally leads us to talk about the treatment of sex and money in the TV show Billions. From there we move to more serious matters: The New York City mayor’s race. John is not a fan of the probable winner, Eric Adams, and I press him as to why. We get into it over the squandered opportunities of the Obama years, and we really get into it over Al Sharpton. John is ready to forgive him for the deplorable behavior that defined the first half of his career, and I’m not. And finally, we look at the Jacob Blake shooting a year after the fact. What do we know now that we didn’t know then?We had a lot of fun doing this one, and I hope you have just as much watching it. Let me know what you think here or on Discord.Next week I’ll be posting a conversation with historian David E. Kaiser about the role of “racial justice” in the politicization of historical studies. If you’d like a preview, you can find a previous conversation of ours here. A New Home for TGSThe video for this episode is hosted on my own new YouTube channel, which is now the home of The Glenn Show. I invite you to subscribe to this channel (and click the bell button!) now so that you don't miss future offerings. This newsletter will continue to publish as usual with the same benefits for subscribers.This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Some posh new (temporary) digs for The Glenn Show 1:08 The challenges and liberties of John's New York Times gig 5:24 John's efforts to help mount an unproduced black opera 14:45 The deracialization of “motherfucker” 16:58 The erotics and economics of Billions 20:58 Why John didn't support Eric Adams for NYC mayor 31:04 What undermined the potential of the Obama years? 43:22 Can Glenn ever forgive Al Sharpton? 55:16 Will Eric Adams be able to operate effectively as mayor?59:58 The Jacob Blake shooting, a year laterLinks and ReadingsJohn's NY Times piece, "How 'Woke' Became an Insult"John's NY Times piece, "Can White Men Write a Black Opera?"John's book, Nine Nasty Words: English in the Gutter: Then, Now, and Forever This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

For this edition of The Glenn Show, I’m joined by someone who may be familiar to long-time viewers: Bob Wright. Bob is a distinguished journalist and the author of many books, including The Moral Animal, Nonzero, and Why Buddhism is True. He also happens to be the co-founder of Bloggingheads, the platform on which The Glenn Show was born and has flourished. In our conversation, Bob walks us through the early days of Bloggingheads and the flash of inspiration that led him to create the site. We then move on to discuss Bob’s ideas about evolution and international relations, and how they’re influenced by game theory (something I know a bit about). Bob’s ideas about the nature of conflict and cooperation have a number of implications for combating the sort of nasty political tribalism that we see so much today, both domestically and internationally. Of course, more non-zero sum thinking could possibly help us turn down the temperature in conflicts over race in the US, which would be a welcome change. And finally, we turn our attention to new developments in the relationship between The Glenn Show and Bloggingheads. Both Bob and I are excited about what’s to come! A New Home for TGSThe video for this episode is hosted on my own new YouTube channel, which will soon become the home of The Glenn Show. I invite you to subscribe to this channel (and click the bell button!) now so that you don't miss future offerings. This newsletter will continue to publish as usual with the same benefits for subscribers.This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Subscribe to The Glenn Show on YouTube 0:26 The origins of Bloggingheads 11:30 Non-zero-sum thinking on the global stage 20:30 Bob: We’re not focusing on the most pressing foreign policy dilemmas 29:13 Bridging the globalist vs. nationalist divide 34:13 Could more cognitive empathy ease racial tensions? 45:00 Changes afoot for The Glenn Show and BloggingheadsLinks and ReadingsBloggingheads.tv The Wright ShowBob’s Substack newsletter, The Nonzero NewsletterThe Nonzero Newsletter, “The Last Word on GWOT”Bob’s book, The Moral Animal: Why We Are the Way We Are: The New Science of Evolutionary PsychologyBob’s book, Nonzero: The Logic of Human DestinyBob’s book, Why Buddhism Is True: The Science and Philosophy of Meditation and Enlightenment This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

In this week’s TGS, I’m joined once again by intellectual historian Daniel Bessner. Given Daniel’s area of scholarly expertise—US foreign relations—it should be no surprise that the recent withdrawal from Afghanistan colors our discussion. But we range much further than that. We debate Daniel’s conception of “American empire” and its origins in the Cold War. He is quite critical of American foreign policy during that period (and beyond), and I do push back on some of his more pointed critiques. We go on to discuss the course of America’s engagement with the world after the Cold War’s end, and Daniel offers a theory as to why the 1990s saw so much popular interest in World War II. We move on to discuss climate change as a particular kind of foreign policy problem. I out myself not exactly as a “climate skeptic,” but as someone who thinks we may be panicking prematurely. And yet, I think that changes in the climate may force us to radically rethink where and how we find meaning in our lives. Finally, since we’re both professors, we talk about Covid and the state of the modern university. As you’ll see, Daniel and I have some very stark disagreements. But he’s a sharp, erudite, and good-natured debating partner, and it’s always a pleasure having him on the show. And if you’re intrigued by his arguments, subscribe to his podcast, American Prestige. I’m sure you’ll have some comments on this one, and I’m looking forward to reading them. This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Daniel’s new podcast, American Prestige10:22 Did the US needlessly prolong the Cold War? 14:59 Daniel: The Cold War actually limited political liberty within the US21:27 The cultural logic of American empire 32:59 Global inequities and existential threats40:52 The spiritual challenges of climate change50:34 Glenn: Capitalism is “the natural order of things”55:23 What Covid reveals about the modern American universityLinks and ReadingsDaniel’s new podcast, American PrestigePaul Thomas Chamberlin’s book, The Cold War’s Killing Fields: Rethinking the Long PeaceDaniel Rodgers’ book, Atlantic Crossings: Social Politics in a Progressive AgePeter Novick’s book, The Holocaust in American LifePeter Novick’s book, That Noble Dream: The “Objectivity” Question and the American Historical ProfessionRoosevelt Montás, Rescuing Socrates: How the Great Books Changed My Life and Why They Matter for a New Generation Glenn Loury’s Intellectual Origins (with Daniel Bessner)Part OnePart TwoPart ThreePart Four This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John McWhorter is back for this week’s episode of The Glenn Show. In it, we discuss John’s new gig writing a newsletter for the New York Times. Anyone wondering whether he’s being stifled by the paper’s editorial sensibilities will be glad to hear the answer is a definite “no.” We spend a while discussing John’s recent piece about the removal of a “racist” rock from the University of Wisconsin-Madison’s campus after administration gave in to student activists. From there we move on to a broader discussion of the historical relationship between the slave trade and American universities. We ask whether modern universities are morally culpable for the sins of the distant past. The scope broadens even further as we ask whether we can ever truly extricate the benefits of the modern world from histories of brutality and genocide. And finally, we move on to a discussion about black conservatives and accusations of “selling out.” This has particular relevance for the case of Larry Elder, a black conservative who is currently nipping at the heels of Gavin Newsom in the California governor’s recall.This is a deep and provocative discussion, and I hope you’ll join in by commenting below. Let me know what you think!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 John's new gig writing for the New York Times 5:01 Wisconsin students get a "racist" rock removed from campus 16:39 Are present-day universities morally accountable for their involvement in the slave trade? 26:38 Debating the legacy of Christopher Columbus 40:18 Can we extricate modernity's benefits from its history of brutality and genocide? 50:52 Is California gubernatorial candidate Larry Elder a sellout? LinksJohn's new New York Times newsletterJohn’s piece, “The Performative Antiracism of Black Students at the U. of Wisconsin”John’s piece, “Let’s talk about ‘Sellouts’” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Here’s something different for you. In this episode of The Glenn Show, I sit down with artist, writer, and TGS Creative Director Nikita Petrov to discuss two fundamental questions: “What the hell is going on?” and “What is to be done?” If those questions sound both deep and broad, there might be a reason. They occurred to Nikita in the wake of a recent psychedelic experience. Not your typical TGS fare, to be sure!The conversation begins with Nikita explaining what he’s learned from working with me and observing my relationships with others. I confirm his suspicions: I am in a very exciting and satisfying stage in my life and career. Nikita then goes on to describe the meditations on human interconnectedness he experienced during his trip. He wants to know: How can we tell a healthy connection from an unhealthy one? Can we formulate a theory as to how to make such a distinction? And how can we apply such a theory to my own present area of concern, the rise of CRT? I try to explain why I think CRT promotes “unhealthy” human connections, and why it risks shutting us off from the richness of human art, culture, thought, and knowledge. We then discuss the relationship between ideology and identity, and we find some parallels between Russian and African American history and politics. And finally, we try to get to the heart of what makes a “Glenn rant” a Glenn rant.I’d love to know what you think. Let me know in the comments. And don’t forget to check out Nikita’s YouTube channel and his newsletter, Psychopolitica!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Glenn's book leave1:45 A psychedelic experience inspires Nikita to talk to Glenn 16:23 Healthy vs. unhealthy human connection 23:12 Glenn: Critical race theory is “self-absorbed and small”38:03 Rising above “sectarian obsession” 49:14 A brief history of Russian political infantilization 57:28 Is Glenn the Jimi Hendrix of ranting?LinksGlenn’s conversation with Cornel West and Teodros KirosCixin Liu, The Three-Body ProblemIrving Howe, A Margin of Hope: An Intellectual AutobiographyNikita’s newsletter, Psychopolitica This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Today, I’ve got a special treat for TGS fans: my first ever recorded conversation with John McWhorter, which occurred on (brace yourselves) November 7, 2007. People who started following John and me in recent years may not be aware of how long we’ve been at this, but it’s been almost 14 years. As you might expect, while the topics we discuss are familiar, our positions relative to each other have changed. In 2007, I was clearly to John’s left! One thing that hasn’t changed is John’s superhuman productivity. He notes at the beginning that he is just finishing up writing two books.We begin by talking about John’s gig as a columnist for the New York Sun. I put the screws to John and ask him in a purposefully un-nuanced way if he is a conservative, and he answers with a typically nuanced response. We discuss John’s then-recent resignation from UC-Berkeley (a very gutsy move) before moving on to broader concerns like globalization’s impact on the black working class, the prospects for cross-racial class solidarity, and how to address racial disparities in education in a more targeted fashion than simply crying “more funding.” At the conversation’s end, we both remark on how much fun it was to talk with each other (even on ancient technology like John’s cordless phone). I’m happy to report that it’s still fun. And I am extremely curious to know what you all think about the differences and similarities between where we started and where we are today. Let me know in the comments!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 A walk down memory lane1:02 John's gig as a columnist4:38 The black intellectual's challenge 17:17 John: There is life outside the academy 34:00 Disappearing factories and black poverty 40:53 Glenn calls for cross-racial working-class solidarity 51:39 Is unequal school funding a red herring? This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Recently I had a rich, deep conversation with lawyer, Current Affairs contributing editor, and former Bernie Sanders National Press Secretary Briahna Joy Gray on her podcast Bad Faith. Briahna and I occupy very different ideological spaces, so I thought TGS viewers would be interested in watching the discussion. She has generously given me permission to share it here.We begin by debating the possible causes of racial disparities and my own ideas about what we should do about it. More funding for social services is often floated as a possible remedy, but I have questions. This segues into a discussion of my essay “The Case for Black Patriotism.” Briahna asks whether my vision of patriotism necessarily entails a belief in American exceptionalism, and this leads into an exploration of capitalism and socialism more broadly. Finally, Briahna asks me a question that many people wonder about: Given my political views (and the fact that I’m not shy about proclaiming them into a microphone), how do my Bernie-supporting wife LaJuan and I keep the peace at home? Briahna and I had a real debate here, but I was surprised by how many concerns we actually share. I hope you enjoy listening to the conversation as much as I enjoyed participating in it! This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Intro 1:40 The bias narrative vs. the development narrative7:02 What are the causes of “behavioral maladies” in black communities?11:36 Will more funding for social services reduce violent crime? 20:37 Glenn: The clock is ticking for the least advantaged African Americans31:44 Debating black patriotism 43:40 American exceptionalism and the dominance of capitalism54:47 The necessary checks on capitalism1:01:41 The call (from Bernie Sanders) is coming from inside the houseLinks Glenn’s essay, “The Bias Narrative vs. the Development Narrative”Glenn’s essay, “The Case for Black Patriotism”Nikole Hannah-Jones’ introduction to the 1619 ProjectNathan J. Robinson’s Current Affairs essay, “Why Critical Race Theory Should Be Taught in Schools” This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

On this edition of TGS, John McWhorter is back for one of our twice-monthly conversations. We take a long, critical look at the concept of "systemic racism"—what it is, what it isn't, and why it's become so popular in progressive discourses about race in the US. We focus attention on institutions of higher education, drawing on our own experience to question whether this concept really applies at the elite institutions (Brown/Berkeley/Columbia) with which we have been associated. We open on a laconic note: neither of us were in the best of moods when we had this conversation. We close by inviting you to suggest topics for our future discussions that are, a) not about race, and, b) areas where John and I are likely to disagree. We hope you'll take us up on this!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 Intro2:19 Does systemic racism still exist in the US?12:26 Addressing “racial inequities” rather than “systemic racism”18:30 John: “The idea that modern colleges and universities are racist spaces is false”29:18 Race and the academic job market34:40 Why does anger persist even after progress toward racial redress?44:57  The (possible) origins of the recent wokeness wave52:55 Glenn and John agree to disagreeLinksKhalil Gibran Muhammad, The Condemnation of Blackness: Race, Crime, and the Making of Modern Urban America This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Above you’ll find my conversation with University of San Francisco law professor Lara Bazelon. She specializes in criminal law and has won exoneration for wrongfully convicted incarcerated people. We discuss systemic racism in the criminal justice system and debate the pros and cons of various reform efforts. We go into the details of Yutico Briley’s wrongful conviction case in which Lara and her sister Emily were involved (you can read Emily’s piece about it here). Then we shift gears and discuss the challenges of writing fiction. We talk about Lara’s absorbing new novel A Good Mother and my memoir-in-progress. These are pretty deep waters, as we reflect on how our writing has forced us to confront some hard questions about our roles as professionals and parents. As always, I’m interested in your thoughts! Let me know in the comments!This post is free and available to the public. To receive early access to TGS episodes, Q&As, and other exclusive content and benefits, click below.0:00 How Glenn and Lara each approach systemic racism 6:46 Lara: The Yutico Briley case exposes the roots of systemic racism 17:32 Trying to understand the equities and inequities of crime and punishment 28:20 The differing perspectives on justice involved in the Briley case 34:44 Are progressive criminal justice policies having an impact? 46:16 Lara's new novel, A Good Mother 54:37 Glenn and Lara's experiences of parenthood 1:01:08 Why Glenn really left Harvard's economics department 1:05:16 Glenn's rocky road as a fatherLinksBari Weiss’ forum on systemic racismGlenn’s book, Race, Incarceration, and American ValuesGlenn’s “intellectual obituary” of James Q. WilsonLara’s novel, A Good Mother This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

This week John and I have something a little different for you: An interview with Wall Street Journal columnist and Manhattan Institute Senior Fellow Jason Riley about his recent book, Maverick: A Biography of Thomas Sowell. We discuss Sowell's ideas, their influence, and his place within the pantheon of American (and black America), intellectuals. Among his innumerable contributions, Sowell's books—especially A Conflict of Visions, Knowledge and Decisions, and Basic Economics—are a particular focus of this wide-ranging conversation. We also get into a broader discussion about black intellectuals, conservatism, and the academy. And don’t worry, Substack subscribers, John and I will be posting our monthly Q&A later this week. Stay tuned!As always, I’m curious to know what you think. Let me know here and on Discord.0:00 Intro 1:10 Comparing the legacies of Thomas Sowell and George Schuyler 5:27 Making the case for Sowell’s significance 16:55 The task of the popularizer 23:55 Why Sowell’s book A Conflict of Visions is important 31:15 The norm of inter-group disparity 40:47 What happened to Glenn’s generation of heterodox Black intellectuals? 50:12 Why it’s hard to be a conservative in academia 59:54 Where is the left-wing critique of progressive racial politics? LinksJason’s book, Maverick: A Biography of Thomas SowellSowell’s book, A Conflict of Visions: Ideological Origins of Political StruggleMatt Taibbi and Katie Halper's talk with Adolph Reed This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Here is my conversation with NYU law professor Richard Epstein. In this conversation, Richard talks about his involvement with a legal action aimed at stopping construction on the currently planned site of the Obama Presidential Center in Chicago. We discuss the legal issues. We also talk about critical race theory—its origins in the legal academy of the 1970s and 80s, its foundational ideas, its impact on American education, and whether it should be banned by law. We conclude with Richard, who urged Trump to resign in January 2017(!), decrying what he sees as a lack of "comity" on the part of the Biden administration.I hope you enjoy the conversation! As always, I’m curious to know what you think. Let me know here and on Discord. 0:00 Why Richard is trying to stop the construction of the Obama Presidential Center on its present site10:20 Richard's stymied attempt to stop alterations to Chicago's Soldiers Field 15:12 Raising questions about the OPC's environmental impact 31:16 Richard's account of critical race theory 39:35 A legal history of racial redress in the US 48:59 Richard: Biden exhibits less comity than Trump did This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Here is my latest conversation with John McWhorter. We begin with a review of our respective academic careers and how being black has affected our work. We also assess the recent involvement of Al Sharpton and Benjamin Crump in the case of a white Arkansas man who was shot dead in June, under suspicious circumstances, by a police officer during a traffic stop. We close with an extended discussion of critical race theory, which we define carefully and evaluate thoroughly. We agree that CRT should not be banned by law, but we endorse the efforts of parents to weigh-in with their local schools against it.And, in case you haven’t seen it, we are now taking questions for our next Q&A. Let us know what’s on your mind! 0:00 John McWhorter, master of his craft5:18 Is John a “black linguist”? Is Glenn a “black economist”? 13:45 Al Sharpton and Benjamin Crump address police violence against white victims24:25 What we talk about when we talk about CRT35:35 Is the CRT debate comparable to other debates in education? 43:43 Glenn: It is tyrannical to ban the teaching of CRT  This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Today I’m posting something a little different than normal. This is a conversation with NYU political scientist Larry Mead. It’s part of his series “Culture and Poverty,” and he’s generously allowed me to repost it here at The Glenn Show. We discuss some ideas from Larry’s book, Burdens of Freedom: Cultural Difference and American Power. Larry argues, among other things, that one of the major distinctions between “Western” and “non-Western” cultures is the role of individualism. Larry sees Western culture—as exemplified by the US—as predominately individualist in its orientation. When immigrants from non-Western cultures struggle to assimilate, he argues, it’s often because they have problems adjusting to this individualist orientation.There are certainly merits to this argument. But in this discussion, I push back on Larry’s description of African American culture as basically non-Western. This, it seems to me, ignores a number of important facts about African American social and political history after the Civil War. It’s a lively back and forth, and I’m curious what you think. 0:00 Intro 2:04 Larry's view of Western and non-Western culture 5:32 Is African American culture "non-Western"? 14:57 Larry: "Freedom is a threat" to Black and Latino families 24:08 African American individualism after emancipation 36:00 The "paradox" of Asian academic success 48:26 What are the origins of European political development? This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Here, John and I begin with an assessment of a sharp, thoughtful Quillette piece by black intellectual Aaron Hanna which is critical of black conservatives. (Both John and I have written responses which Quillette will publish.) This lead us into philosophical terrain, where we engage questions about free will, ethnic/racial differences in culture and so on. We go on to discuss critically a recent New York Times piece by Jenée Desmond-Harris, “Which Black People Should You Listen To?” Her answer, which we dispute: not people like us! We critically assess Thomas Sowell's "black rednecks" argument, that black culture reflects the legacy of Scotch-Irish norms common to Southern/Appalachian enclaves. And we agree to disagree about the merits of Charles Murray's new book, Facing Reality, where I find more merit than does John.As always, I’m curious to know what you think.I originally posted this earlier this week for paying subscribers. I’m now releasing it for the general public. If you want to get the full episodes early, plus other exclusive content and benefits, please subscribe now. Let’s keep doing the work!0:00 A peek inside Glenn’s writing process3:31 Aaron Hana’s critique of Thomas Sowell and Shelby Steele13:50 Extending the presumption of free will to black communities19:31 Who gets to opine on race matters?32:09 Black rednecks44:31 Is the “acting white” phenomenon real?53:58 A critique of Charles Murray’s new book …1:12:12 … and a defense of sameIf there's a short segment (under 2:20) from this episode that you thought was especially good, please share the timestamps in the comments—we’re looking to spread the word on Twitter. This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Here is my conversation with Charles Murray (of The Bell Curve fame) about his new book, Facing Reality: Two Truths about Race in America. We review the argument of his book—that the "American Creed" of fair play and equal treatment for all is imperiled by a failure to reckon with the actual differences across racial groups in measured intelligence and participation in violent crime. We explore the evidence for his claim about racial differences, the extent to which these facts are being denied, and the plausibility of his concern that said denial threatens to undermine the republic. We also discuss the effectiveness of policy interventions aimed at reducing racial disparities. As always, I’m curious to know what you think. 0:00 Intro 1:37 How Charles deals with his notoriety 5:26 Charles's new book, Facing Reality: Two Truths about Race in America 13:49 Grappling with the fact of group disparities 21:04 Threats from the left, threats from the right 27:33 The shift in white attitudes toward race since the 1950s 35:11 What would happen if white people revolted? 41:13 Charles: Black people are not genetically inferior 50:36 Why small differences in ability can have major consequences 54:29 Charles: We need universal, not race-based, public policy solutions This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Here’s my latest conversation with John McWhorter. Our talk ranges over a number of seemingly unrelated subjects. We discuss the decision by Princeton's classics department to stop requiring students to master Greek and Latin (which John sees as a lowering of standards). We analyze the general problem Black students face of deciding whether to "dispel" doubts about their abilities through outstanding performance on the tests, or to "dismiss" those doubts by rejecting the tests as intrinsically biased. We also talk about my appearance on Tucker Carlson's Fox News platform (which John had advised against). And we conclude, anticipating the upcoming Father’s Day celebrations, with some reflections on fatherhood.0:00 Intro 1:30 John takes issue with antiracism in Princeton’s classics department 15:48 Glenn: Black people should embrace and exceed institutional standards 25:22 Meeting the challenge of academic performance 33:57 Stepping outside yourself 40:28 Glenn’s recent appearance on Tucker Carlson Today 51:14 Glenn and John remember their fathersI need your help …Now that we've got a community of listeners, readers, and viewers coalescing around the Glenn Show, I'd like to ask for your input. If you've got a favorite segment from this episode or any other video that I post here, let me know. Is there a minute or two (but no longer than 2:20) that grabs you? If so, comment below with a time stamp from the video or audio. This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Last week, I have announced at Patreon that I’m moving the operation to Substack. I gave every Patron a complimentary subscription for the first month. If you’re reading this, chances are you are such a person, with a comp that will run out on July 2. At that date, you will have to decide if you want to continue getting subscriber-only posts for $7/month or $70/year. I hope the things you’ll see in this first month will convince you to stay.Some of you have already made up your mind. I see that several hundred people have switched to a paid option and made the first payment. Many have chosen an annual rather than a monthly subscription, which is cheaper for you and costs less in transaction fees for us. Some people have opted for a “founding member” plan, which allows you to pay a custom, bigger amount. All of this is deeply appreciated.This post is the first TGS episode published through Substack. It’s my conversation with noted philosopher and public intellectual Cornel West and philosopher Teodros Kiros.We discuss their book, Conversations with Cornel West. Along the way we engage vigorously with one another on themes of religion, politics, aesthetics, identity, and nationalism. We find many points of agreement. It is a rich and intensive exchange.Some timestamps:0:00 Teodros's new book, Conversations with Cornel West 1:04 Cornel offers spiritual counsel to Glenn 11:06 Between commercialization and democratic decay 20:52 Glenn: “The glass is way more than half-full” for Black Americans 29:26 The centrality of Black music to Black experience 36:03 Cornel’s Chekhovian Christianity 43:40 What system, if any, can replace American capitalism? 56:42 The meaning of 1776Notice that this post doubles as a podcast episode. To subscribe to the RSS feed in your podcast app, click on the "listen in podcast app" link in the audio player, which will generate a private RSS for you, or you can access it from your account settings. There, you’ll need to click on a link called "Set up your podcast app."Please, let me know in the comments if the new system is working, and if you have any questions or requests.I’m looking forward to experimenting with different kinds of content, paid and unpaid, here at Substack. I’m excited to embark on this new chapter with you! This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Larry's concerns about the debt-to-GDP ratio ... On the general relativity of fiscal language ... Why would anybody buy U.S. treasury bonds? ... Larry's defense of fiscal hawkishness ... A critique of Biden's COVID relief funding ... How to raise taxes while maintaining incentives to work ... There is no such thing as a corporation ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John's appearance on "Real Time with Bill Maher" ... Why John's 2000 book Losing the Race remains relevant today ... The "noble victim complex" ... The counterproductivity of victim narratives ... Where do you draw the line in calling out nonsense? ... Trading agency for victim status ... The exciting roster of upcoming TGS guests ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The founding of Voices of Black Mothers United ... How the criminal justice system failed Sylvia's daughter ... Sylvia's work: advocacy, community intervention, and positive policing ... What is the role of systems and structures in street violence? ... How Voices of Black Mothers United is branching out ... Sylvia's book, Mind Fields: A Healing Journey to Survive the Murder of a Child ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Critical Race Theory's prevalence in American schools ... What’s at the root of racial disparities in education? ... Destandardizing the standards for success ... The evolution of how we communicate about race ... Kendi and the cops; Bazelon and systemic racism ... ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The impact of the Glenn Show and new initiatives ... How to reach out to the Glenn Show: thework@glennshow.com ... The current climate: how afraid are people and how afraid should they be? ... The current climate: how afraid are people and how afraid should they be? ... Seeking to engage productively with opinions we may not understand ... Glenn's interactions with his graduate and undergraduate students ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Fighting through Covid-19 and the pandemic ... Daunte Wright and how police violence goes beyond race ... The "fake" narrative about Black people and the cops ... The tremendously high stakes of race matters in the U.S. ... America's "badass motherfucker" problem ... Woke hypocrisy as the Chauvin verdict nears ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Life as a university professor during Covid ... What happened to the civil rights movement? ... Glenn and John disagree on voter suppression ... Debating Stacey Abrams’ approach to politics ... The exaggeration of victimhood ... How social media has changed academia ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Who was moral and political philosopher John Rawls? ... Why Rawls' "A Theory of Justice" is such an important text ... Is taxation an infringement on liberty? ... Understanding the freedom vs. liberty paradox ... Focusing on the poor to improve human well-being ... Accounting for earned success or failure ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The contentious origins of Glenn and John's relationship ... Cancellations at Georgetown and racial disparities in academic performance ... What is to blame for racial disparities in academic performance? ... The quality-fit tradeoff and the mismatch effect ... Is racism widespread in American universities? ... Cornel West's departure from Harvard ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Patreon Q&A announcement ... Glenn's initial impressions of BLM ... How should racial justice advocates advance their interests? ... The problem of colleges as "spaces of consumption" ... The pros and cons of cancel culture ... Cancel culture as a "weapon of the weak" ... Glenn's feelings about Trump's presidency ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

New anti-racist guidelines for teaching math in Oregon ... Defending the ideals of the Enlightenment ... What anti-racists get wrong about knowledge and achievement ... Why class matters more than race for improving education in the U.S. ... The Capitol riot and the threat(s) of political extremism ... Possible new frontiers for the Glenn Show ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Changing the narrative on race in America ... Navigating the increasingly polarized landscape ... Why Glenn takes issue with the 1619 Project ... Bob’s new Apocalypse Aversion Project ... Confronting nationalism and identity politics ... Globalization, privilege, and "meritocratic hubris" ... The evolution of Bloggingheads.tv ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Do Glenn and John over-discuss race and racism? ... The hurdles to hosting debates on TGS ... The guys consider their role in the national discourse on race ... The challenges of being a contrarian ... Confronting in-school violence among Black youth ... The New York Times' "contemptible" treatment of Donald McNeil ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Tracing wokeism's origins to mid-century postmodernism ... Determining the right historical narrative on race ... Do progressives have a problem confronting their own racism? ... What can and can't be said about the 2020 election ... Can the insurrectionists be defended? ... Biden vs. Trump on critical race theory ... James challenges Glenn's recent mea culpa on Trump ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Monthly Q&A with Glenn and John ... TGS 2.0, new newsletters, and John's new book ... Critiquing the Biden administration's first moves ... The excesses and dangers of critical race theory ... The latest stories of woke hysteria on campus ... The performative outrage of anti-racist crusaders ... Campus wokeism vs. corporate wokeism ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Robert's work on rising homicide rates in U.S cities ... The connection between work, school, and crime ... How some criminal justice reform attempts have failed ... Why the massive upsurge in crime in U.S. cities in 2020? ... The challenge of "engaging the family" in the U.S. ... The surprising data on gender in single-parent homes ... Did the summer 2020 protests lead to the rise in crime? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Glenn Show 2.0 and reactions to the storming of the Capitol ... What if it was BLM protesters that stormed the Capitol? ... Glenn: I was wrong about the threat Trump posed to democracy ... The tectonic plates shifting beneath American society and politics ... Glenn and John debate the merits of impeachment ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The three books that pushed Glenn away from the right ... A crisis of identity: who is Glenn Loury and what is his project? ... Glenn's left-leaning moderatism and work in the 90s ... The link between Glenn's economic work and his social theory ... The evolution of Glenn's perspective on Obama ... The Iraq War, the 2008 crash, and how "the elites failed us" ... The current and future state of the American university ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Glenn's rightward shift in the early 80s ... A feeling of alienation from the Black elite ... Glenn and Daniel discuss neoliberalism and the "American empire" ... Glenn's emergence as a public intellectual ... How Glenn earned a unique place in public discourse ... Glenn's hiatus from and return to economic theory ... How Glenn helped coin the term "social capital" ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Why won't Jones, Kendi, and others come on the Glenn Show? ... The need for more discussions between black intellectuals who disagree ... The dilemma faced by contrarian black intellectuals ... John and Glenn ponder their niche ... What can't be said about race ... Will we see a more honest discourse on race after Trump? ... John explores the current controversy at the Dalton School in NYC ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

A working-class undergrad with a job, a wife, and two kids ... Why Glenn was drawn to economics ... How studying economics shaped Glenn's politics ... Anti-Semitism at Harvard and the origins of MIT economics ... Why Glenn believes in meritocracy ... Glenn discusses his influential early work ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Coleman Hughes named to Forbes' "30 Under 30" ... The predictable platitudes of John's critics ... The waning of wokeness ... Should Thomas Jefferson have known better? ... What is driving today's race crusaders? ... The denial of Black agency ... Nikole Hannah-Jones and the “1619 Riots” ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The political landscape in Chicago in 2020 ... How do you improve a human being? ... What "The Bell Curve" missed about human development ... How teaching and empowering parents positively impacts children ... The taboo of family-focused anti-poverty efforts ... What is the source of implicit bias? ... James: Politicians on both sides cultivate and exploit racial turmoil ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Welcome to the Glenn Show 2.0 ... A path to forgiveness for the canceled ... John’s upcoming book and wokeism after Trump ... Why is it so easy to get away with junk sociology today? ... John speaks his mind on Ibram X. Kendi ... The mass delusion of the anti-racism movement ... What is required of public intellectuals? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Leon's new journal Liberties and the current political climate ... Leon: Art "should not be subjected to a political standard" ... Glenn and Leon disagree on Trump ... Leon, an “unrepentant interventionist,” discusses foreign policy ... What's inside the first edition of Liberties? ... Leon defends the idea of Zionism ... America and Israel: two experiments in moving past anti-Semitism ... Thoughts on America's moment of racial reckoning ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Glenn announces a new version of The Glenn Show ... Eli and Shelby's new documentary, What Killed Michael Brown? ... "Why is it so hard to see the truth here?" ... Shelby: Post-'60s liberalism is the culprit ... What changed in black communities between 1950 and 1980? ... White guilt as a drug ... Eli: BLM had an agenda and was waiting for a tragedy to exploit ... Shelby: The solutions lie in old-fashioned values ... A father and son collaboration ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Jon's new book, Trump's Democrats ... Doing ethnography in the Rust Belt, an Italian-American suburb, and Appalachia ... Jon: Trump is a familiar figure to these voters ... How Trump embodies honor culture ... Trump's flouting of the norms of the professional class ... Why this style works better locally than nationally ... Jon: Race is not as important as place ... Will Trump's Democrats defect to Biden? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Glenn critiques attempts to make race a part of academic hiring ... "Optics equality" and the denial of group differences ... Improving low-income primary schools ... Topics on which you can't challenge the consensus ... Glenn's letter denouncing his own university's president over BLM ... Can academics "cite inclusively"? ... Will online education disrupt colleges? ... Advice for a nontenured professor with heterodox views ... What should a university administrator do? ... ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

A tribute from an Israeli fan and a mea culpa from John ... The political influence of Ice Cube and Kanye West ... Shelby Steele’s new documentary, What Killed Michael Brown? ... Appeals to American honor vs. appeals to American guilt ... The effects of economic restructuring on Black social mobility ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Glenn on the persistence of racial inequality ... Adaner on the persistence of racial inequality ... Determinism vs. individual moral judgment ... Is structural racism a real thing? ... Can exhortation change culture? ... Why Glenn prefers universal programs ... Does capitalism reinforce racial inequality? ... Contingent moments in America's racial history ... Glenn and Adaner offer some policy solutions ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Daniel's book, The Meritocracy Trap ... Daniel: Meritocracy props up medical innovation at the expense of health ... Examining meritocracy in economics departments ... Daniel says legal education in Germany is easier and better ... Daniel: Higher education is much too intensive and much too exclusive ... Olympic athletes are far better than they were 70 years ago. Is that a good thing? ... Glenn asks if Daniel's position requires him to repudiate affirmative action ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Ian's path from engineering to educational entrepreneurship ... Ian rebuts the "corporate type" charge ... "1776 Unites," an alternative narrative to the 1619 Project ... Glenn presents a conservative case against reparations ... What can be done to help the black family? ... Why are black students suspended more often than white students? ... Ian: Black faith leaders are needed to bridge the divide ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

BLM and the looming threat of political violence ... Can social justice movements redefine what counts as “knowledge”? ... Sympathy and objectivity in ethnographic writing ... Remembering Stanley Crouch ... Princeton’s racial justice pickle ... Le Monde takes an interest in Glenn and John ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Peter: "Mismatch theory" is not a front for racial prejudice ... The problem of data transparency and affirmative action ... Who gets access to affirmative action data? ... Repairing the “broken trust” of America’s racial history ... Would more data transparency actually stop race-based affirmative action? ... Determining the optimal amount of affirmative action ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Peter's controversial research on racial disparities among STEM majors ... Is affirmative action leading to a dumbed down curriculum? ... Peter's work on the lawsuit alleging Harvard discriminates against Asian-American applicants ... Roland Fryer's research on race and lethal police force ... Stories vs. statistics ... Remembering Glenn's late wife, economist Linda Datcher Loury ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John detects a burgeoning pushback against racial wokeness ... The anti-racist “bluff” ... Glenn: Most Americans agree with Trump’s defenses of the police ... Comparing the 1963 March on Washington to its 2020 sequel ... Why doesn’t Trump disavow violence committed in his name? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The complex heterogeneity of Black American politics ... Why are there so few conservatives in academia? ... Is there any hope of attracting more of them? ... Glenn proposes the creation of a Conservative Studies program ... How Covid-induced austerity might affect diversity in university hiring ... Would it even be possible to staff a conservative academic institution? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Peter: The police aren’t hated, but politicians are listening to the haters ... What is driving rising violent crime rates in NYC? ... The problem of discussing racial disparities in crime and policing ... Contesting Jill Lepore’s account of the history of policing ... Disambiguating police defunding and police reform ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The two crises in Chicago ... Richard: "The quarantines are overdoing it" ... Richard's critique of clinical trials for pharmaceuticals ... The recent looting in Chicago ... A classical liberal approach to fixing housing on the South Side ... Why didn't the Chicago PD stop the looting? ... Richard praises Trump's "fairly solid record of achievement" ... Will vote by mail produce a disaster? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The feasibility of group testing for Covid ... Is Trump responsible for inadequate testing? ... Larry: The government should fund companies developing rapid home testing ... Critiquing the FDA’s approach to testing ... Larry: Rapid home testing could bring the economy back within three weeks ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Why Michele thinks schools shouldn't have closed ... Are teachers’ unions bad for students? ... Glenn: Teachers are almost certainly not a high-risk group ... Is the school reopening fight about health concerns or politics? ... Maintaining student accountability in distance learning ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Debating Charles Murray’s new book, Human Diversity: The Biology of Gender, Race, and Class ... Amy: It is an undeniable fact that there are IQ differences between whites and blacks ... Do group IQ differences have a place in politics? ... Does public opinion about race influence elites? ... Amy: Bohemians belong on the margins of society ... The benefits of a meritocratic society ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John on "a truly medieval moment" ... Why Glenn didn't sign the Harper's open letter ... Linguists petition against fellow linguist Steven Pinker ... Is this actually just about the economics of the collapsing media industry? ... Calling someone a racist vs. calling someone a witch ... John's harsh review of White Fragility ... Critiquing an open letter by 300 Princeton professors on anti-racism ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John explains how the current national crisis came to be ... Is civic discourse dead? ... Glenn: We are sliding into a state where the basic preconditions of society are at question ... Is America going backwards on race? ... Glenn: "I feel like my side is losing, and I think it's a catastrophe" ... Can faith help bind up the nation's wounds? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John: White Fragility is "one of the worst books ever written" ... Debating how we should remember Woodrow Wilson ... Glenn: Our story is about more than just domination and oppression ... On being a dissident black academic ... Why John resigned from the board of the National Books Critics Circle ... Should John and Glenn fear defenestration by the mob? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

David's memoir, A Life in History ... David: Political history is being ignored in the academy ... Defending the Western model ... Did the Vietnam War spark a turn away from Enlightenment values? ... The 1619 Project and the ideals of the founding ... The lament of the white male ... Why is college so expensive? ... Did the founders actually believe in universal values? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

How Glenn and Carol first met ... Carol's 1993 book, Black Faces, Black Interests ... Would Stacey Abrams have won if she were pro-life? ... Carol's journey to Christianity ... Carol's prescient book on the new white nationalism ... Carol: "I have a lot of respect for Jared Taylor" ... Carol's harsh critique of identity politics on college campuses ... Are black conservatives winning, losing, or something else? ... Why Carol loves Donald Trump ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Coleman's post-collegiate life (with a cameo from Glenn's wife) ... Reopening and the invisible cost of agreeing with Trump ... Thomas Sowell's thoughts on partisanship ... Glenn: Trump is "bumbling his way through" the tradeoffs of reopening ... Masks as a way of life ... Do racial disparities in Covid deaths demonstrate systemic bias? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John: George Floyd's murder was not an exclusively racial matter ... Glenn: "We're in the grip of hysteria" ... John: Apparently anti-racism trumps even medical science ... What it's like being a black contrarian right now ... Glenn: The real threat to black people is crime ... John argues that fixing problems with the cops has to be the first step ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Was the pandemic lockdown overkill? ... How Michele transitioned her high school students to distance learning ... Michele: We changed the rules on our students ... The “herd mentality” opposing herd immunity ... Michele: “Teachers should be getting back to work” ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Josh: This is a more dangerous moment than any I can remember ... Was George Floyd lynched? ... Glenn views police abuse as a universal problem and fears racialized backlash ... Josh worries about free and fair elections in November ... Glenn: Violence and looting must be denounced ... Glenn and Josh agree that Trump is not up to the task ... The price of order and the cost of chaos ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The death of George Floyd in Minneapolis ... Is crime a moral failing? ... Glenn: "Black people in poor cities need the cops" ... The Central Park birder incident ... Meditating on the tears of Eddie Glaude ... Glenn decries Biden's racial pandering ... John: The problem is with cops and with guns, not racism ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Amy wants to starve the higher ed beast ... Do Americans need affirmative action for graduate school? ... Glenn and Amy criticize undergraduate instruction ... Amy: "There's a certain degree of feminization that is going on as well" ... How should students be graded during the pandemic? ... Amy explains what we should and shouldn't be doing during the pandemic ... The Wuhan lab theory ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Michael's new documentary, Created Equal: Justice Thomas in His Own Words ... Is some of the criticism of Thomas from the left racist? ... Why isn't he celebrated in the black community? ... Thomas's originalist view of the Constitution ... Thomas's wife Ginni, a conservative activist ... How Thomas's grandfather shaped his life ... The Anita Hill hearings and their legacy ... Why does Thomas rarely speak at oral argument? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Nikole Hannah-Jones wins a Pulitzer Prize for the 1619 Project ... Glenn: This is "a desperate struggle for dignity" in the face of black failure ... Self-hatred and patronization ... Glenn: A bubble that I thought would burst hasn't burst ... Biden's black agenda vs. Glenn's black agenda ... John: Black men need jobs ... Race and the picking of fruit ... Glenn: Don't teach children that their future is outside of their hands ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Brandon explains what a coronavirus is ... Where the virus came from ... Evaluating the "laboratory escape" theory ... The path to an effective vaccine ... Brandon: We have not been alarmist about the pandemic ... Why a forecasting model can be way off but still correct ... Brandon: The federal government has underreacted from the start ... Brandon critiques the surgeon general's messages to African Americans ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Jody describes what it's like inside his hospital ... How an outbreak in a prison could overwhelm the local hospital system ... Jody: "Most people don't need to be locked up, and don't need to be locked up for that long" ... What about all the murderers and rapists? ... Why Jody is not a prison abolitionist ... How Covid kills ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

How would the late Mark Kleiman have viewed the policy response to the pandemic? ... The democratic legitimacy of the administrative state ... Glenn: Policy experts can't determine human values ... Are the economic tradeoffs of shutdown too great? ... Harold: The costs of Covid are vivid in people's lives ... Did Trump unintentionally help tamp down civil unrest? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

How Bob joined and eventually split with the civil rights movement ... Critiquing the government bureaucracy of the American welfare state ... Bob: Affirmative action has been exploited by middle-class blacks ... Black achievement during the century after the Civil War ... Glenn asks, "what is to be done?" ... Bob: "I don't have any choice but to be optimistic" ... Glenn: "Black people ought not to be taught to hate our country" ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John on being at Covid ground zero in Queens ... The many racial disparities the pandemic has made plain ... But after the disparities are acknowledged, now what? ... Differences in life expectancy, health, and diet ... Does the pandemic make the case for universal healthcare? ... Racial discrimination by health care providers ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Wilfred's new book, Taboo: 10 Facts You Can't Talk About ... The view of corona from Western Kentucky ... Wilfred: A universal shutdown doesn't make sense... ... ...instead we need random serological testing ... Is the pandemic revealing a structural weakness of democracy? ... Examining the racial disparity in infection rates ... Glenn: Experts should be "on tap, not on top" ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Applying just war theory to the pandemic ... Danielle's three options: "freeze," "surrender," and "mobilize and transition" ... There's never been a vaccine for a coronavirus ... How Danielle's COVID-19 response working group came together ... Mixing free-market and command-economy strategies ... Trump's "request for proposals" ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John reports on sheltering in place in NYC ... Race and the coronavirus ... Is calling the disease the "China virus" xenophobic? ... John wants President Cuomo ... Glenn: "You go to the crisis with the president you've got, not the president that you wish you had" ... John maligns and Glenn defends the president ... Do you feel safe? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Personal finance during a public health emergency ... Harold: No one totally understands the US economy ... Social isolation and emotional support ... Thought experiment: 600K deaths vs. a massive recession ... Looking back at the HIV epidemic ... Does it make sense to compare our situation with South Korea's? ... Will the virus kill identity politics? ... Harold is very pleased that Dems went with the moderate ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Rajiv: Testing is the key to defeating coronavirus ... How do we know if we're overreacting to the virus? ... Considering credit forbearance ... Rajiv argues for public banking through the Federal Reserve ... Debating universal basic income ... The ethics of public imposition ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Why quarantine is not enough ... Larry's proposal for a universal mandatory testing regime ... Glenn pushes back on Larry's plan on economic and libertarian grounds ... Is inflation coming? ... The importance of the "velocity" of money ... Why public health must come before economic health ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Heather argues that we are overreacting to the coronavirus ... Heather: "Everyone should be a capitalist in a pandemic" ... Public goods and exponential growth ... Grading the Trump administration's handling of the crisis ... Has the media exaggerated the threat? ... Glenn predicts this will be a major blow to populism ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

How COVID-19 is affecting Glenn and John’s semester ... The mass psychology of coronavirus-inspired shutdowns ... Glenn: The social justice implications of the virus are legitimate ... Will Trump’s handling of the crisis be his downfall? ... Glenn: “The pussy grabber needs help!” ... Is Trump an effective politician or a hapless dolt? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The recent spike in assaults on ultra-Orthodox Jews in NYC ... Is anti-Semitism or something else the root cause? ... Bob: The demonization of Israeli Jews has filtered down ... Are liberal Jews downplaying black anti-Semitism? ... Bob argues that Palestinians in Israel are doing relatively well ... Glenn: "There ain't gonna be no two-state solution" ... Ex-Leninist Bob makes the case against Bernie ... Would a Jewish president be good for the Jews? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Ian describes the charter school network he runs ... How teachers are treated in charters vs. in public schools ... Ian rebuts the charge that charters cherrypick their students ... Why Ian's schools are all single-sex ... The political campaign against charters ... Ian's critique of using the 1619 Project as curriculum ... The "Who's your daddy?" truck in the Bronx ... Is the racial achievement gap the wrong problem to focus on? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Glenn's landmark 1977 paper, "A Dynamic Theory of Racial Income Differences" ... Glenn's theory of "relations before transactions" ... Critics accused Glenn of "flirting with the idea of black inferiority" ... What William F. Buckley said that broke Glenn's heart ... Why do Maine and Vermont let prisoners vote, when most states don't? ... Glenn vows to finish his memoir this summer ... The roles that two black academics played in Glenn's early career ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Do blacks and Latinos have aligning interests? ... Ernesto: Immigrants have an irrational belief in the American dream ... Debating the benefits of immigration ... Can universal health care and open immigration be reconciled? ... Why Peter called Mexicans the "ambivalent minority" ... Will Latinos socially assimilate? Will blacks be left behind again? ... Revisiting Lincoln's Second Inaugural ... Ernesto: Most Latinos just want to work ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John: The central claim of the NYT's 1619 Project "simply isn't true" ... Glenn offers a defense of the Project's perspective ... What the Constitution's three-fifths clause really meant ... John: "America is an endless rehearsal" ... After Kobe Bryant died, was it bad taste to bring up his rape accusation? ... Glenn praises Khalil Gibran Muhammad's The Condemnation of Blackness ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Wesley's new book of essays, The Souls of Yellow Folk ... The meaning of Andrew Yang as an Asian American ... Ivy League admissions, intermarriage, and Harvard's "personality scores" ... Wesley: There's a "false crisis" about race in NYC elite public schools ... Wesley's essay about the Virginia Tech mass shooter ... The dismissed grievances of the Asian-American male ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

John: The racial conversation has improved over the past decade ... Decrying the "racism" explanation when black people don't succeed in a given field ... Glenn: "You're the weakest sister at the table, and you're gonna place demands?" ... The young black men who jump turnstiles and cross in the middle of the street ... So what does Martin Luther King Day mean now? ... How and why black culture changed so much between 1960 and 1970 ... Do changing sensibilities exonerate Russell Simmons? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Is impeachment justified? ... Summarizing Corey Robin's new book, The Enigma of Clarence Thomas ... Scott: Robin doesn't understand Thomas's actual constitutional interpretation ... Critiquing Robin's psychological reading of Thomas's childhood ... Thomas's actual views on gender and the family ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

What's new about the culture wars? ... Meghan: "White women are the new white men" ... Reacting vs. responding ... Meghan: Gen Xers had the advantage of second-wave feminist childhoods ... Meghan's controversial essay on "toxic femininity" ... The different kinds of power men and women have ... The case for and against pussy hats ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Peter explains how stop-and-frisk went too far ... Who or what deserves credit for NYC's massive murder decline? ... Peter: Reducing poverty is not the way to reduce crime ... Are cops reaping the whirlwind? ... The aftermath of Freddie Gray in Baltimore and Laquan McDonald in Chicago ... Criminal justice reform and the potential backlash ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Bob reminisces about the origins of Bloggingheads.tv ... Where The Glenn Show fits into the BhTV ecosystem ... Speech policing, the "n-word," and the uses of ridicule ... What's Trump's executive order on anti-Semitism really about? ... Does the IDW care about protecting speech critical of Israel? ... Bob critiques The Trayvon Hoax ... Bob: Be wary of throwing around the word "hoax" ... Quillette accuses Bob of palling around with tyranny apologists ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Glenn and John respond to criticism of their discussion of The Trayvon Hoax ... Why Glenn finds the film credible despite its creator's conspiracy theories ... John: The public didn't get the full story of Zimmerman's 911 call ... The case as a forerunner of larger dynamics in American political culture ... Did Zimmerman have a rational prejudice? ... Glenn and John ain't running away ... What was Trayvon thinking? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

George Zimmerman sues a bunch of people for $100 million ... Rightwing filmmaker Joel Gilbert's The Trayvon Hoax ... Gilbert's past conspiracy theorizing ... An age of fake news and relativism ... What John thinks really happened ... Recent racially charged hoaxes ... The racial narrative and "whose side are you on?" ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Does the US tax system favor the rich? ... Why spending is more equally distributed than wealth ... How Larry makes his calculations ... How billionaires can avoid paying taxes ... Larry: We should tax consumption instead of income or wealth ... Larry critiques Andrew Yang's universal basic income plan ... Should Trump get credit for a good economy? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Critiquing William Nordhaus's work on the economics of climate change ... Larry: My plan for carbon taxation is a win-win ... Can elderly voters who don't care about the future be won over? ... What about critics of capitalism itself? ... Accounting for the uncertainties of climate science ... The work of the 2019 Economics Nobel laureates ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

The Niskanen Center's defense of a "free-market welfare state" ... Hidden ways the government obstructs the free market ... Why a wealth tax probably wouldn't work ... Steve's ambivalence about impeachment ... Glenn says the emoluments charges are "penny ante b******t" ... Steve: Trumpism has to be defeated at the ballot box ... The vain search for the "generic Democrat" ... What happens to the NeverTrumpers post-Trump? ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Buzzwords vs. the power of reason ... College students stay silent instead of saying the wrong thing ... Why cultural appropriation is such a flashpoint ... John: "It's hard to be an individual" ... Cosmopolitanism and fearing the cops ... The sense of belonging that comes from being oppressed ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Coleman's new essay, "The Case for Black Optimism" ... Does it make sense to compare blacks and whites in terms of progress? ... Glenn presents the counterargument ... Coleman detests that blacks are viewed as "one massive problem" ... Glenn sees many blacks as being in desperate straits ... The problem with focusing too much on problems ... Coleman's congressional testimony on reparations ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Glenn wants to hear more before supporting impeachment ... John: "Does it not bother you that your country is being run by an idiot?" ... Is Trump a truer tribune of the people than Obama? ... Glenn fears violent civil unrest if Trump is ousted ... Abortion and Trump's Supreme Court picks ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

What does it mean to be a black conservative? ... Why Glenn's views on affirmative action have shifted back and forth ... What happens if affirmative action is eliminated? ... Glenn critiques the idea of a "New Jim Crow" ... The case against reparations ... Feeling like the token black conservative ... Could reparations lead to a national spiritual renewal? ... Glenn takes questions from the audience ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe

Is polarization a problem to be solved with "water or fire"? ... If Trump wins reelection, will national reconciliation be possible? ... How John's biography prepared him for this work ... Love thy political antagonist as thyself ... Marianne Williamson and the possibility of racial forgiveness ... Martin Luther King's legacy in today's black activist movements ... Glenn: Any movement for justice must be transracial ... This is a public episode. If you’d like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit glennloury.substack.com/subscribe